From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id ; Tue, 16 Jan 2001 16:21:25 -0500 Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org id ; Tue, 16 Jan 2001 16:21:15 -0500 Received: from munchkin.spectacle-pond.org ([209.192.197.45]:26126 "EHLO munchkin.spectacle-pond.org") by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id ; Tue, 16 Jan 2001 16:21:04 -0500 Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 16:23:15 -0500 From: Michael Meissner To: Andi Kleen Cc: Michael Meissner , linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org Subject: Re: Linux not adhering to BIOS Drive boot order? Message-ID: <20010116162315.B1609@munchkin.spectacle-pond.org> In-Reply-To: <1355693A51C0D211B55A00105ACCFE64E95191@ATL_MS1> <20010116153757.A1609@munchkin.spectacle-pond.org> <20010116220125.A10985@gruyere.muc.suse.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2i In-Reply-To: <20010116220125.A10985@gruyere.muc.suse.de>; from ak@suse.de on Tue, Jan 16, 2001 at 10:01:25PM +0100 Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org On Tue, Jan 16, 2001 at 10:01:25PM +0100, Andi Kleen wrote: > On Tue, Jan 16, 2001 at 03:37:57PM -0500, Michael Meissner wrote: > > don't assume that the way your system gets booted is the way everybody's does, > > particularly those on platforms other than the x86. > > > > I must say, as a 5 year Linux user (and 23 year UNIX user/administrator), I do > > get tired of having to hunt down and deal with each of these changes that come > > up from time to time with Linux (ie, switching from ipfwadm to ipchains to > > netfilter, or in this case reordering how scsi adapters/network adapters are > > looked up). > > Bad example. > > netfilter does not force you to switch anything. You can just load the ipchains > or even the ipfw module and use your old scripts. Granted I was mainly thinking of the ipfwadm->ipchains conversion, but you have to root around and load the appropriate module. I like to build as much into the kernel as possible, and it took some amount of time to get things so that I could build the ipchains modules, since you are presented with choices that preclude building of the modules. If I had been using make config instead of make xconfig, it would have been worse, since I would have to go through the questions each time to get to the network section. I could also use the various incompatible transforms MD support has had over the years for another example, or the number of times system status monitors break due to changes in the output of /proc files (and yes I grant you many of the changes are due to poor programming in the status programs, but not all of them). Yes, change is one of the things that makes Linux strong. However, change to the way things are done can piss people off to using an alternate system, such as happened to Sun when they changed from the BSD method of system administration to System V many years ago. -- Michael Meissner, Red Hat, Inc. (GCC group) PMB 198, 174 Littleton Road #3, Westford, Massachusetts 01886, USA Work: meissner@redhat.com phone: +1 978-486-9304 Non-work: meissner@spectacle-pond.org fax: +1 978-692-4482 - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/