From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id ; Fri, 26 Jan 2001 09:12:20 -0500 Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org id ; Fri, 26 Jan 2001 09:12:11 -0500 Received: from pcep-jamie.cern.ch ([137.138.38.126]:10511 "EHLO pcep-jamie.cern.ch") by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id ; Fri, 26 Jan 2001 09:11:58 -0500 Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 15:10:58 +0100 From: Jamie Lokier To: "David S. Miller" Cc: James Sutherland , Matti Aarnio , "H. Peter Anvin" , linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org Subject: Re: hotmail not dealing with ECN Message-ID: <20010126151058.A6331@pcep-jamie.cern.ch> In-Reply-To: <14961.24658.319734.448248@pizda.ninka.net> <14961.25754.449497.640325@pizda.ninka.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <14961.25754.449497.640325@pizda.ninka.net>; from davem@redhat.com on Fri, Jan 26, 2001 at 03:50:50AM -0800 Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org David S. Miller wrote: > > Every single connection to ECN-broken sites would work as normal - it > > would just take an extra few seconds. Instead of "Hotmail doesn't > > work!" it becomes "Hrm... Hotmail is fscking slow, but Yahoo is fine. I'll > > use Yahoo". A few million of those, and suddenly Hotmail isn't so hot... > > No, as explained in previous emails, no retry scheme can work. > > Hotmails failing machines, for example, send RST packets back when > they see ECN. Ignoring valid TCP RST frames is unacceptable and > Linux will not do that as long as I am maintaining it. How about this for a deployment plan: Ignore only _one_ RST frame (the first one), either per destination IP address or per connection. It's equivalent to a little "controlled" network loss :-) First SYN includes ECN. Second and subsequent SYNs do not. This won't provide the benefits of ECN on a heavily congested network, but it is a start on a lightly congested one. In a few months you can flip the switch to stop ignoring RST frames and enable ECN on all SYNs. -- Jamie - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/