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From: Pavel Machek <pavel@suse.cz>
To: "Theodore Ts'o" <tytso@mit.edu>,
	Oliver Xymoron <oxymoron@waste.org>,
	Linus Torvalds <torvalds@transmeta.com>,
	linux-kernel <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>
Subject: Re: [PATCH] (0/4) Entropy accounting fixes
Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2001 10:05:25 +0000	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <20011102100525.Y35@toy.ucw.cz> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20020819054359.GB26519@think.thunk.org>; from tytso@mit.edu on Mon, Aug 19, 2002 at 01:43:59AM -0400

Hi!

> >  What entropy can be measured from disk timings are very often leaked
> >  by immediately relaying data to web, shell, or X clients.  Further,
> >  patterns of drive head movement can be remotely controlled by clients
> >  talking to file and web servers. Thus, while disk timing might be an
> >  attractive source of entropy, it can't be used in a typical server
> >  environment without great caution.
> 
> This is something to be concerned about, to be sure.  But generally a
> client won't have complete control of the drive head movement ---
> there are other clients involved --- and the adversary generally won't
> have complete knowledge of the block allocation of files, for example,
> so he/she would not be able to characterize the disk drive timings to
> the degree of accuracy required.

You seem  assume that adversary is on remote system. That's not neccessarily
the case.

Imagine you wanting to generate gpg key while I have normal user account
on the machine. I can sample /proc/interrupts, measure disk speeds etc...
Perhaps we are alone on [otherwise idle] machine. You still don't want me 
to guess your key.

								Pavel
-- 
Philips Velo 1: 1"x4"x8", 300gram, 60, 12MB, 40bogomips, linux, mutt,
details at http://atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz/~pavel/velo/index.html.


  reply	other threads:[~2002-08-23 19:50 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 86+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2002-08-18  2:15 Oliver Xymoron
2002-08-18  2:23 ` [PATCH] (1/4) " Oliver Xymoron
2002-08-18  2:26   ` [PATCH] (2/4) Update input drivers Oliver Xymoron
2002-08-18  2:29     ` [PATCH] (3/4) SA_RANDOM user fixup Oliver Xymoron
2002-08-18  2:32       ` [PATCH] (4/4) entropy batching update Oliver Xymoron
2002-08-18  2:30 ` [PATCH] (0/4) Entropy accounting fixes Linus Torvalds
2002-08-18  2:59   ` Oliver Xymoron
2002-08-18  3:08     ` Linus Torvalds
2002-08-18  3:25       ` Linus Torvalds
2002-08-18  4:42         ` Oliver Xymoron
2002-08-18  4:53           ` Linus Torvalds
2002-08-18  5:05             ` Dmitri
2002-08-18  6:18               ` Oliver Xymoron
2002-08-22  3:33             ` David Wagner
2002-08-18 10:30         ` Alan Cox
2002-08-18 15:08           ` Oliver Xymoron
2002-08-18 17:31           ` Jonathan Lundell
2002-08-22  3:27         ` David Wagner
2002-08-18  4:30       ` Oliver Xymoron
2002-08-21  8:44       ` Rogier Wolff
2002-08-21 12:47         ` Oliver Xymoron
2002-08-18  5:28     ` Andreas Dilger
2002-08-18  5:53       ` Oliver Xymoron
2002-08-22  3:25   ` David Wagner
2002-08-18  3:05 ` Linus Torvalds
2002-08-18  3:51   ` Robert Love
2002-08-18  4:01     ` Linus Torvalds
2002-08-18  5:38       ` Oliver Xymoron
2002-08-19  4:21         ` Theodore Ts'o
2002-08-19 10:15           ` Marco Colombo
2002-08-19 10:25             ` Oliver Neukum
2002-08-19 11:03               ` Marco Colombo
2002-08-19 14:22                 ` Oliver Neukum
2002-08-19 15:21                   ` Marco Colombo
2002-08-19 16:29                     ` Oliver Neukum
2002-08-19 12:39           ` Oliver Xymoron
2002-08-18  6:31       ` Robert Love
2002-08-18  6:48         ` Oliver Xymoron
2002-08-18  4:06     ` dean gaudet
2002-08-18  4:44       ` Oliver Xymoron
2002-08-18  7:31       ` Bernd Eckenfels
2002-08-18  9:48         ` Ralf Baechle
2002-08-20 12:51           ` Bernd Eckenfels
2002-08-18 16:58         ` Robert Love
2002-08-18 10:25       ` Alan Cox
2002-08-19 10:47         ` Marco Colombo
2002-08-19 12:29           ` Alan Cox
2002-08-19 12:56             ` Marco Colombo
2002-09-08  3:43             ` D. Hugh Redelmeier
2002-09-08 18:03               ` David Wagner
2002-09-09 16:53                 ` Oliver Xymoron
2002-09-09 16:58                   ` David Wagner
2002-09-09 19:47                     ` Oliver Xymoron
2002-09-09 23:22                       ` David Wagner
2002-09-16 22:51                       ` dean gaudet
2002-09-17  1:18                         ` Oliver Xymoron
2002-09-09 18:54                   ` Kent Borg
2002-09-09 19:57                     ` Oliver Xymoron
2002-09-09 20:11                       ` Kent Borg
2002-08-18  4:57     ` Oliver Xymoron
2002-08-18  4:28   ` Oliver Xymoron
2002-08-18  4:51     ` Linus Torvalds
2002-08-18  5:24       ` Oliver Xymoron
2002-08-18 16:59         ` Linus Torvalds
2001-11-02 10:34           ` Pavel Machek
2002-08-23 20:16             ` Linus Torvalds
2002-08-18 17:03           ` Robert Love
2002-08-18 17:31           ` Oliver Xymoron
2002-08-18 16:54     ` Robert Love
2002-08-18 17:18       ` Oliver Xymoron
2002-08-18 17:20         ` Robert Love
2002-08-19  5:43 ` Theodore Ts'o
2001-11-02 10:05   ` Pavel Machek [this message]
2002-08-19  6:06   ` *Challenge* Finding a solution (When kernel boots it does not display any system info) louie miranda
2002-08-19  7:30     ` Gilad Ben-Yossef
2002-08-19  7:30     ` Ryan Cumming
2002-08-20  0:55       ` louie miranda
2002-08-19 13:52   ` [PATCH] (0/4) Entropy accounting fixes Oliver Xymoron
2002-08-20  8:59     ` Tommi Kyntola
2002-08-20 13:21       ` Oliver Xymoron
2002-08-20 16:19         ` Tommi Kyntola
2002-08-20 17:22           ` Oliver Xymoron
2002-09-08  3:51             ` D. Hugh Redelmeier
2002-09-08  4:31               ` Oliver Xymoron
2002-08-18  4:57 David Brownell
2002-08-18  6:02 ` Oliver Xymoron

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