From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S262352AbVBXOZO (ORCPT ); Thu, 24 Feb 2005 09:25:14 -0500 Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org id S262355AbVBXOZO (ORCPT ); Thu, 24 Feb 2005 09:25:14 -0500 Received: from users.linvision.com ([62.58.92.114]:57230 "HELO bitwizard.nl") by vger.kernel.org with SMTP id S262352AbVBXOZH (ORCPT ); Thu, 24 Feb 2005 09:25:07 -0500 Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2005 15:25:02 +0100 From: Erik Mouw To: Greg KH Cc: mikem , linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, linux-scsi@vger.kernel.org Subject: Re: CSMI questions Message-ID: <20050224142502.GC13226@harddisk-recovery.com> References: <20050222171656.GA5953@beardog.cca.cpqcorp.net> <20050222231450.GB10067@kroah.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20050222231450.GB10067@kroah.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.28i Organization: Harddisk-recovery.com Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org On Tue, Feb 22, 2005 at 03:14:50PM -0800, Greg KH wrote: > On Tue, Feb 22, 2005 at 11:16:56AM -0600, mikem wrote: > > I'd also like an (brief) explanation of why ioctls are so bad. I've seen the > > reasons of them never going away, etc. But from the beginning of time (UNIX) > > ioctls have been the preferred method of user space/kernel communication. > > That's because there was no other method. See the lkml archives for why > ioctls are considered bad, I don't want to dredge it up again. Here's a quote from the official syndicated kernelnewbies fortunes file (http://www.kernelnewbies.org/kernelnewbies-fortunes.tar.gz ): "Basically, ioctl's will _never_ be done right, because of the way people think about them. They are a back door. They are by design typeless and without rules. They are, in fact, the Microsoft of UNIX." - Linus Torvalds on linux-kernel For the full story, see http://lkml.org/lkml/2001/5/20/81 . Erik -- +-- Erik Mouw -- www.harddisk-recovery.com -- +31 70 370 12 90 -- | Lab address: Delftechpark 26, 2628 XH, Delft, The Netherlands