From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S1751157AbWEVTlv (ORCPT ); Mon, 22 May 2006 15:41:51 -0400 Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org id S1751158AbWEVTlv (ORCPT ); Mon, 22 May 2006 15:41:51 -0400 Received: from gprs189-60.eurotel.cz ([160.218.189.60]:62153 "EHLO amd.ucw.cz") by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S1751157AbWEVTlv (ORCPT ); Mon, 22 May 2006 15:41:51 -0400 Date: Mon, 22 May 2006 21:41:08 +0200 From: Pavel Machek To: John Richard Moser Cc: Arjan van de Ven , linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org Subject: Re: [PATCH] 2.6.16.16 Parameter-controlled mmap/stack randomization Message-ID: <20060522194108.GF2979@elf.ucw.cz> References: <20060522010606.GC25434@elf.ucw.cz> <44712605.4000001@comcast.net> <20060522083352.GA11923@elf.ucw.cz> <4471E77F.1010704@comcast.net> <20060522170036.GD1893@elf.ucw.cz> <4471FAD0.9060403@comcast.net> <20060522184003.GD2979@elf.ucw.cz> <44720ACB.7040808@comcast.net> <20060522191230.GE2979@elf.ucw.cz> <447210B3.10401@comcast.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <447210B3.10401@comcast.net> X-Warning: Reading this can be dangerous to your mental health. User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.11+cvs20060126 Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org Hi! > >>> Good. So fix emacs/oracle/pine, and year or so and some time after it > >>> is fixed, we can change kernel defaults. That's still less bad than > >>> having > >>> > >>> [ ] Break emacs > >>> > >>> in kernel config. > >> Nobody is going to fix emacs/oracle/pine, they don't have to. Nothing > >> is making them. The kernel will wait for them so who cares. > > > > No, _you_ have to fix emacs/oracle/pine. You claimed your patch is > > interesting for secure distros, so you obviously have manpower for > > that, right? > > RHAT probably fixed Emacs already since it broke on them. Adamantix and > Hardened Gentoo are most likely to put manpower into things like pine.. > they put a lot of work into removing textrels on i386. > > Oracle we can't do anything about. It's commercial. If we break it, > they will recommend running it on Solaris or Windows 2003. Well, if RedHat ships randomization, it will make Oracle fix it quite quickly :-). > > As you may have noticed, I'm at receiving end of those bug > > reports. And what you propose is actually *worse* than IDE, because at > > least you get relatively clear error message when misconfiguring IDE. > > Yes but when you misconfigure IDE the system doesn't boot. When you > turn up randomization too high, everything works but 1 or 2 > programs. Yes, you'll very quickly realize you misconfigured IDE... while stack randomization is going to break 2 apps and you'll not know why. > > For x86-64... why not? > > On x86-64 he may, if you can convince him it's useful (asserting that I do not care much about randomization, sorry. I see it may be useful on x86-64, but I do not think configurability helps. Sorry. Pavel -- (english) http://www.livejournal.com/~pavelmachek (cesky, pictures) http://atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz/~pavel/picture/horses/blog.html