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From: "Ph. Marek" <philipp.marek@bmlv.gv.at>
To: "H. Peter Anvin" <hpa@zytor.com>
Cc: Alan Cox <alan@lxorguk.ukuu.org.uk>,
	Chris Snook <csnook@redhat.com>,
	Jack Stone <jack@hawkeye.stone.uk.eu.org>,
	linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, linux-fsdevel@vger.kernel.org,
	akpm@linux-foundation.org, viro@zeniv.linux.org.uk,
	alan <alan@clueserver.org>
Subject: Re: Versioning file system
Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2007 10:05:15 +0200	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <200706201005.16323.philipp.marek@bmlv.gv.at> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <467853BB.1090109@zytor.com>

On Mittwoch, 20. Juni 2007, H. Peter Anvin wrote:
> Alan Cox wrote:
> > POSIX is very
> > clear about what is acceptable as magic in a pathname, and the unix spec
> > even more so.  The NetApp approach recognizes two important things
> >
> > 1.	Old version access is the oddity not the norm
> > 2.	Standards behaviour is important
>
> 3. An atomic snapshot is more useful than a bunch of disconnected
> per-file version.  Kind of like CVS vs SVN.

I believe that since some decision must be made *when* a snapshot is taken, 
and that should (has to) be done by userspace, a userspace versioning system 
for doing the backups is the right solution. [1]

Whether there is some filesystem (FUSE or native) that allows online browsing 
of the backups or not is another matter.

Ad 1: What userspace needs is
- atomic snapshots of complete directory trees, independent of mount
  boundaries (across filesystems)
- an atomic way to change the state of the filesystem for the *whole* system.
  For FSVS I'll try to use unionfs for that - populate some new directory with
  my tree of changes, then overmount that over "/", and move the files over
  one-by-one until the new directory is empty. (Must be checked on reboot, of
  course).

These are actually two similar operations (from the atomic view), but have to 
be done in completely different ways ... Maybe there could be some "better" 
interface (if there is one - I don't know what could really be removed from 
the above workflow).


Regards,

Phil

  reply	other threads:[~2007-06-20  8:06 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 107+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2007-06-15 22:23 Jack Stone
2007-06-15 22:38 ` H. Peter Anvin
2007-06-15 22:51   ` alan
2007-06-15 22:59     ` H. Peter Anvin
2007-06-15 23:06       ` alan
2007-06-16  8:11     ` Jack Stone
2007-06-16  9:46       ` Jeffrey V. Merkey
2007-06-16 10:12         ` Jeffrey V. Merkey
2007-06-16 13:15           ` Mark Williamson
2007-06-16 19:57             ` Jeffrey V. Merkey
2007-06-16 16:49           ` Jan Harkes
2007-06-16 20:03             ` Jeffrey V. Merkey
2007-06-16 19:38               ` Jack Stone
2007-06-16 20:08               ` Alan Cox
2007-06-16 21:25                 ` Jeffrey V. Merkey
2007-06-16 20:39               ` Jan Harkes
2007-06-16 20:43                 ` Jack Stone
2007-06-16 22:17                 ` Alan Cox
2007-06-17  2:18                   ` Jeffrey V. Merkey
2007-06-17  2:39                     ` Jeffrey V. Merkey
2007-06-17 22:11                   ` Dale Amon
2007-06-16 21:06               ` Dale Amon
2007-06-16 11:42         ` Graham Murray
2007-06-16 14:53     ` Jörn Engel
2007-06-18  9:45       ` Andreas Dilger
2007-06-18  9:54         ` Jack Stone
2007-06-18 10:13         ` Jörn Engel
2007-06-18 14:01         ` Theodore Tso
2007-06-18 16:16           ` alan
2007-06-18 17:29             ` Theodore Tso
2007-06-18 17:33               ` Jeremy Allison
2007-06-18 20:30                 ` Theodore Tso
2007-06-18 20:50                   ` J. Bruce Fields
2007-06-18 17:46               ` H. Peter Anvin
2007-07-04 17:32               ` Erik Mouw
2007-07-04 20:47                 ` Theodore Tso
2007-07-05 17:55                   ` Erik Mouw
2007-07-05 13:57                 ` John Stoffel
2007-07-05 14:23                   ` Chris Mason
2007-07-05 17:57                   ` Erik Mouw
2007-06-18 15:32         ` Chris Mason
2007-06-18 23:18           ` Bron Gondwana
2007-09-29 17:44         ` Sorin Faibish
2007-06-15 22:52 ` Chris Snook
2007-06-16  8:25   ` Jack Stone
2007-06-19 18:03     ` Chris Snook
2007-06-19 19:06       ` Jack Stone
2007-06-19 20:03         ` Chris Snook
2007-06-19 20:08           ` Jack Stone
2007-06-19 20:15             ` Chris Snook
2007-06-19 20:27               ` Jack Stone
2007-06-19 20:34             ` John Stoffel
2007-06-19 20:38               ` Jack Stone
2007-06-19 20:38               ` Matthew Wilcox
2007-06-19 21:02                 ` John Stoffel
2007-06-19 19:08       ` H. Peter Anvin
2007-06-19 19:12         ` Jack Stone
2007-06-19 19:15           ` H. Peter Anvin
2007-06-19 19:22             ` Jack Stone
2007-06-19 20:10           ` Chris Snook
2007-06-19 20:14             ` Jack Stone
2007-06-19 20:31               ` Chris Snook
2007-06-20  8:34           ` Bernd Petrovitsch
2007-06-19 21:50         ` Alan Cox
2007-06-19 22:07           ` H. Peter Anvin
2007-06-20  8:05             ` Ph. Marek [this message]
2007-06-19 20:43       ` Lennart Sorensen
2007-06-19 22:07         ` david
2007-06-19 22:13           ` H. Peter Anvin
2007-06-19 23:07             ` Jan Harkes
2007-06-19 23:12               ` H. Peter Anvin
2007-06-19 22:21           ` Lennart Sorensen
2007-06-19 23:35         ` Bryan Henderson
2007-06-20  0:27           ` Trond Myklebust
2007-06-20  5:00             ` H. Peter Anvin
2007-06-20 17:04             ` Bryan Henderson
2007-06-20 17:10               ` H. Peter Anvin
2007-06-20 17:33               ` Chris Snook
2007-06-15 22:57 ` Kok, Auke
2007-06-15 23:01   ` alan
2007-06-16 11:20     ` Johannes Weiner
     [not found] <OFC119F96F.A721E445-ON882572FE.0055140A-882572FE.00571482@us.ibm.com>
2007-06-18 16:37 ` Jack Stone
2007-06-18 16:56   ` H. Peter Anvin
2007-06-18 17:56   ` Bryan Henderson
2007-06-19  3:10     ` Kyle Moffett
2007-06-19  7:49       ` Jack Stone
2007-06-19  7:58       ` Bron Gondwana
2007-06-20  2:43         ` Kyle Moffett
2007-06-19  9:09       ` Martin Langhoff
2007-06-19 16:52       ` Jakub Narebski
     [not found] <8wst3-3kh-31@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found] ` <8wsCC-3wf-21@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]   ` <8wsW4-3UY-3@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]     ` <8wJal-3KA-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]       ` <8xm22-4Ql-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]         ` <8xq5G-32l-7@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]           ` <8xs7w-69W-21@gated-at.bofh.it>
2007-06-18 20:54             ` Bodo Eggert
2007-06-18 21:08               ` alan
2007-06-18 21:31                 ` H. Peter Anvin
2007-06-18 21:34                   ` Jeremy Allison
2007-06-18 22:10                   ` Theodore Tso
2007-06-18 22:26                     ` Jörn Engel
2007-06-18 21:24                       ` Brad Boyer
2007-06-19  3:15                         ` Kyle Moffett
2007-06-18 22:34                       ` Jeremy Allison
2007-06-18 22:56                       ` alan
2007-06-19  7:01                       ` Theodore Tso
2007-06-18 22:48                     ` Jeremy Allison
2007-06-18 23:00                       ` alan
2007-06-19  7:05                       ` Theodore Tso
2007-06-19 16:52                         ` Jeremy Allison
2007-06-19 16:56                           ` H. Peter Anvin
2007-06-18 22:47                   ` alan

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