From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S1754907AbYEDHsT (ORCPT ); Sun, 4 May 2008 03:48:19 -0400 Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org id S1752705AbYEDHsK (ORCPT ); Sun, 4 May 2008 03:48:10 -0400 Received: from smtp5.pp.htv.fi ([213.243.153.39]:40759 "EHLO smtp5.pp.htv.fi" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-OK) by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S1752692AbYEDHsJ (ORCPT ); Sun, 4 May 2008 03:48:09 -0400 Date: Sun, 4 May 2008 10:47:08 +0300 From: Adrian Bunk To: Valdis.Kletnieks@vt.edu Cc: Ingo Molnar , Dmitry Torokhov , linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, "Rafael J. Wysocki" , Andrew Morton Subject: Re: Ingo, no more kconfig patches Message-ID: <20080504074708.GD5838@cs181133002.pp.htv.fi> References: <20080430230100.GK29330@cs181133002.pp.htv.fi> <20080501025234.GE27574@elte.hu> <20080501115923.GX29330@cs181133002.pp.htv.fi> <20080503191445.GF5292@elte.hu> <20080503202416.GR5838@cs181133002.pp.htv.fi> <20080503210300.GA10979@elte.hu> <20080503212429.GT5838@cs181133002.pp.htv.fi> <20080503215214.GA18407@elte.hu> <20080503220330.GV5838@cs181133002.pp.htv.fi> <19743.1209873251@turing-police.cc.vt.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <19743.1209873251@turing-police.cc.vt.edu> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.17+20080114 (2008-01-14) Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org List-ID: X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org On Sat, May 03, 2008 at 11:54:11PM -0400, Valdis.Kletnieks@vt.edu wrote: > On Sun, 04 May 2008 01:03:30 +0300, Adrian Bunk said: > > On Sat, May 03, 2008 at 11:52:14PM +0200, Ingo Molnar wrote: > > > > My larger point is that this kconfig tool bug breeds a constant stream > > > of avoidable breakages, which causes lost manpower and causes a stream > > > of trivial patches hindering maintainers all around the tree. Because > > > every such trivial patch has to be reviewed, tested, it clogs the commit > > > logs, etc. > > > > > > So the more trivial patches we _avoid_ having to do in the future, the > > > better. I'm not sure why you are even arguing against this this rather > > > simple point - your arguments are rather hard to understand. Wouldnt you > > > be happier if a whole category of trivial breakages was avoided and if > > > you didnt have to deal with and waste your time on that category of > > > trivial patches anymore? > > > > > > Most of the time reoccuring trivial patches are an indicator of some > > > deeper structural problem - as in this case. > > > > Your conclusions are based on an assumption that isn't true. > > > > "trivial patches" are the patches you send. > > > > But they are often bogus. > > > > Fixing these issues properly often requires a deeper understanding of > > both kconfig and the dependencies of the underlying code. > > I suspect that Ingo is however correct Ingo claims the problem was trivial since the patches were trivial. But fact is they aren't trivial - as you can e.g. see on Ingos patch that started this thread, and that was for the completely wrong place. > - although a *proper* fix of one of > these bugs requires human-intelligence to figure out what's *really* intended, > the kconfig program *does* have enough information available to issue a a clear > warning: > > "Yo doodz - I don't know *what* you intended here, but this SELECT is just > waiting to sink its teeth into somebody's posterior. You might want to fix it > somehow before somebody needs rabies shots..." >... And what do you want to do in such a case? Kconfig is a user interface, and we actually need such cases you want to warn for for getting a good UI. We already know what can cause problems. But as far as I know there are no such problems users actually ran into in recent stable kernels - and most of the problems (like the one in this thread) are pathological cornercases you only see with randconfig. cu Adrian -- "Is there not promise of rain?" Ling Tan asked suddenly out of the darkness. There had been need of rain for many days. "Only a promise," Lao Er said. Pearl S. Buck - Dragon Seed