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[2003:d8:2f47:2b00:c5f3:4053:2918:d17c]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id ffacd0b85a97d-3b7811b82c6sm6510602f8f.49.2025.07.28.01.44.13 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 28 Jul 2025 01:44:14 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <4057479d-6ece-49a2-b823-99748e8c9c35@redhat.com> Date: Mon, 28 Jul 2025 10:44:13 +0200 Precedence: bulk X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org List-Id: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Subject: Re: [RFC] Disable auto_movable_ratio for selfhosted memmap To: Oscar Salvador Cc: linux-mm@kvack.org, linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, Michal Hocko , Hannes Reinecke References: From: David Hildenbrand Content-Language: en-US Autocrypt: addr=david@redhat.com; keydata= xsFNBFXLn5EBEAC+zYvAFJxCBY9Tr1xZgcESmxVNI/0ffzE/ZQOiHJl6mGkmA1R7/uUpiCjJ dBrn+lhhOYjjNefFQou6478faXE6o2AhmebqT4KiQoUQFV4R7y1KMEKoSyy8hQaK1umALTdL QZLQMzNE74ap+GDK0wnacPQFpcG1AE9RMq3aeErY5tujekBS32jfC/7AnH7I0v1v1TbbK3Gp XNeiN4QroO+5qaSr0ID2sz5jtBLRb15RMre27E1ImpaIv2Jw8NJgW0k/D1RyKCwaTsgRdwuK Kx/Y91XuSBdz0uOyU/S8kM1+ag0wvsGlpBVxRR/xw/E8M7TEwuCZQArqqTCmkG6HGcXFT0V9 PXFNNgV5jXMQRwU0O/ztJIQqsE5LsUomE//bLwzj9IVsaQpKDqW6TAPjcdBDPLHvriq7kGjt WhVhdl0qEYB8lkBEU7V2Yb+SYhmhpDrti9Fq1EsmhiHSkxJcGREoMK/63r9WLZYI3+4W2rAc UucZa4OT27U5ZISjNg3Ev0rxU5UH2/pT4wJCfxwocmqaRr6UYmrtZmND89X0KigoFD/XSeVv jwBRNjPAubK9/k5NoRrYqztM9W6sJqrH8+UWZ1Idd/DdmogJh0gNC0+N42Za9yBRURfIdKSb B3JfpUqcWwE7vUaYrHG1nw54pLUoPG6sAA7Mehl3nd4pZUALHwARAQABzSREYXZpZCBIaWxk ZW5icmFuZCA8ZGF2aWRAcmVkaGF0LmNvbT7CwZgEEwEIAEICGwMGCwkIBwMCBhUIAgkKCwQW AgMBAh4BAheAAhkBFiEEG9nKrXNcTDpGDfzKTd4Q9wD/g1oFAmgsLPQFCRvGjuMACgkQTd4Q 9wD/g1o0bxAAqYC7gTyGj5rZwvy1VesF6YoQncH0yI79lvXUYOX+Nngko4v4dTlOQvrd/vhb 02e9FtpA1CxgwdgIPFKIuXvdSyXAp0xXuIuRPQYbgNriQFkaBlHe9mSf8O09J3SCVa/5ezKM OLW/OONSV/Fr2VI1wxAYj3/Rb+U6rpzqIQ3Uh/5Rjmla6pTl7Z9/o1zKlVOX1SxVGSrlXhqt kwdbjdj/csSzoAbUF/duDuhyEl11/xStm/lBMzVuf3ZhV5SSgLAflLBo4l6mR5RolpPv5wad GpYS/hm7HsmEA0PBAPNb5DvZQ7vNaX23FlgylSXyv72UVsObHsu6pT4sfoxvJ5nJxvzGi69U s1uryvlAfS6E+D5ULrV35taTwSpcBAh0/RqRbV0mTc57vvAoXofBDcs3Z30IReFS34QSpjvl Hxbe7itHGuuhEVM1qmq2U72ezOQ7MzADbwCtn+yGeISQqeFn9QMAZVAkXsc9Wp0SW/WQKb76 FkSRalBZcc2vXM0VqhFVzTb6iNqYXqVKyuPKwhBunhTt6XnIfhpRgqveCPNIasSX05VQR6/a OBHZX3seTikp7A1z9iZIsdtJxB88dGkpeMj6qJ5RLzUsPUVPodEcz1B5aTEbYK6428H8MeLq NFPwmknOlDzQNC6RND8Ez7YEhzqvw7263MojcmmPcLelYbfOwU0EVcufkQEQAOfX3n0g0fZz Bgm/S2zF/kxQKCEKP8ID+Vz8sy2GpDvveBq4H2Y34XWsT1zLJdvqPI4af4ZSMxuerWjXbVWb T6d4odQIG0fKx4F8NccDqbgHeZRNajXeeJ3R7gAzvWvQNLz4piHrO/B4tf8svmRBL0ZB5P5A 2uhdwLU3NZuK22zpNn4is87BPWF8HhY0L5fafgDMOqnf4guJVJPYNPhUFzXUbPqOKOkL8ojk CXxkOFHAbjstSK5Ca3fKquY3rdX3DNo+EL7FvAiw1mUtS+5GeYE+RMnDCsVFm/C7kY8c2d0G NWkB9pJM5+mnIoFNxy7YBcldYATVeOHoY4LyaUWNnAvFYWp08dHWfZo9WCiJMuTfgtH9tc75 7QanMVdPt6fDK8UUXIBLQ2TWr/sQKE9xtFuEmoQGlE1l6bGaDnnMLcYu+Asp3kDT0w4zYGsx 5r6XQVRH4+5N6eHZiaeYtFOujp5n+pjBaQK7wUUjDilPQ5QMzIuCL4YjVoylWiBNknvQWBXS lQCWmavOT9sttGQXdPCC5ynI+1ymZC1ORZKANLnRAb0NH/UCzcsstw2TAkFnMEbo9Zu9w7Kv AxBQXWeXhJI9XQssfrf4Gusdqx8nPEpfOqCtbbwJMATbHyqLt7/oz/5deGuwxgb65pWIzufa N7eop7uh+6bezi+rugUI+w6DABEBAAHCwXwEGAEIACYCGwwWIQQb2cqtc1xMOkYN/MpN3hD3 AP+DWgUCaCwtJQUJG8aPFAAKCRBN3hD3AP+DWlDnD/4k2TW+HyOOOePVm23F5HOhNNd7nNv3 Vq2cLcW1DteHUdxMO0X+zqrKDHI5hgnE/E2QH9jyV8mB8l/ndElobciaJcbl1cM43vVzPIWn 01vW62oxUNtEvzLLxGLPTrnMxWdZgxr7ACCWKUnMGE2E8eca0cT2pnIJoQRz242xqe/nYxBB /BAK+dsxHIfcQzl88G83oaO7vb7s/cWMYRKOg+WIgp0MJ8DO2IU5JmUtyJB+V3YzzM4cMic3 bNn8nHjTWw/9+QQ5vg3TXHZ5XMu9mtfw2La3bHJ6AybL0DvEkdGxk6YHqJVEukciLMWDWqQQ RtbBhqcprgUxipNvdn9KwNpGciM+hNtM9kf9gt0fjv79l/FiSw6KbCPX9b636GzgNy0Ev2UV m00EtcpRXXMlEpbP4V947ufWVK2Mz7RFUfU4+ETDd1scMQDHzrXItryHLZWhopPI4Z+ps0rB CQHfSpl+wG4XbJJu1D8/Ww3FsO42TMFrNr2/cmqwuUZ0a0uxrpkNYrsGjkEu7a+9MheyTzcm vyU2knz5/stkTN2LKz5REqOe24oRnypjpAfaoxRYXs+F8wml519InWlwCra49IUSxD1hXPxO WBe5lqcozu9LpNDH/brVSzHCSb7vjNGvvSVESDuoiHK8gNlf0v+epy5WYd7CGAgODPvDShGN g3eXuA== Organization: Red Hat In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On 28.07.25 10:15, Oscar Salvador wrote: > Hi, Hi, > > Currently, we have several mechanisms to pick a zone for the new memory we are > onlining. > Eventually, we will land on zone_for_pfn_range() which will pick the zone. > > Two of these mechanisms are 'movable_node' and 'auto-movable' policy. > The former will put every single hotpluggled memory in ZONE_MOVABLE > (unless we can keep zones contiguous by not doing so), while the latter > will put it in ZONA_MOVABLE IFF we are within the established ratio > MOVABLE:KERNEL. It's more complicated, because we have the concept of memory groups. Dynamic memory groups allow for a mixture of MOVABLE vs. NORMAL within the group, static memory groups want a single type. Hotplugging a large DIMM would online it either as MOVABLE or NORMAL. Similarly with CXL. > > It seems, the later doesn't play well with CXL memory where CXL cards hold really > large amounts of memory, making the ratio fail, and since CXL cards must be removed > as a unit, it can't be done if any memory block fell within > !ZONE_MOVABLE zone. So, user space configured a ratio and the kernel does exactly that: obey the ratio. > > One way to tackle this would be update the ratio every time a new CXL > card gets inserted, but this seems suboptimal. > Another way is that since CXL memory works with selfhosted memmap, we could relax > the check when 'auto-movable' and only look at the ratio if we aren't > working with selfhosted memmap. The memmap is only a small piece of unmovable data we require late at runtime (a bigger factor is user space page tables actually mapping that memory). The zone ratio we have configured in the kernel dates back to the highmem times, where such ratios were considered safe. Maybe there are better defaults for the ratios today, but it really depends on the workload. One could find ways of subtracting the selfhosted part, to account it differently in the kernel, but the memmap is not the only consumer that affects the ratio. I mean, the memmap is roughly 1.6%, I don't think that really makes a difference for you, does it? Can you share some real-life examples? I have a colleague working on one of my old prototypes (memoryhotplugd) for replacing udev rules. The idea there is, to detect that CXL memory is getting hotplugged and keep it offline. Because user space hotplugging that memory (daxctl) will explicitly online it to the proper zone. Things like virtio-mem, DIMMs etc can happily use the auto-movable behavior. But the auto-movable behavior doesn't quite make sense if (a) you want everything movable and (b) daxctl already expects to online the memory itself, usually to ZONE_MOVABLE. So I think this is mostly a user-space problem to solve. -- Cheers, David / dhildenb