From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.0 (2014-02-07) on aws-us-west-2-korg-lkml-1.web.codeaurora.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.0 required=3.0 tests=HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS, MAILING_LIST_MULTI,SPF_PASS,UNPARSEABLE_RELAY autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no version=3.4.0 Received: from mail.kernel.org (mail.kernel.org [198.145.29.99]) by smtp.lore.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 52BC6C4360F for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2019 19:40:28 +0000 (UTC) Received: from vger.kernel.org (vger.kernel.org [209.132.180.67]) by mail.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2F01A20823 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2019 19:40:28 +0000 (UTC) Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S1726311AbfC1Tk0 (ORCPT ); Thu, 28 Mar 2019 15:40:26 -0400 Received: from out30-57.freemail.mail.aliyun.com ([115.124.30.57]:42508 "EHLO out30-57.freemail.mail.aliyun.com" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-OK) by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S1725885AbfC1Tk0 (ORCPT ); Thu, 28 Mar 2019 15:40:26 -0400 X-Alimail-AntiSpam: AC=PASS;BC=-1|-1;BR=01201311R471e4;CH=green;DM=||false|;FP=0|-1|-1|-1|0|-1|-1|-1;HT=e01f04391;MF=yang.shi@linux.alibaba.com;NM=1;PH=DS;RN=13;SR=0;TI=SMTPD_---0TNrZtXd_1553802015; Received: from US-143344MP.local(mailfrom:yang.shi@linux.alibaba.com fp:SMTPD_---0TNrZtXd_1553802015) by smtp.aliyun-inc.com(127.0.0.1); Fri, 29 Mar 2019 03:40:22 +0800 Subject: Re: [RFC PATCH 0/10] Another Approach to Use PMEM as NUMA Node To: Michal Hocko Cc: Dan Williams , Mel Gorman , Rik van Riel , Johannes Weiner , Andrew Morton , Dave Hansen , Keith Busch , Fengguang Wu , "Du, Fan" , "Huang, Ying" , Linux MM , Linux Kernel Mailing List References: <43a1a59d-dc4a-6159-2c78-e1faeb6e0e46@linux.alibaba.com> <20190326183731.GV28406@dhcp22.suse.cz> <20190327090100.GD11927@dhcp22.suse.cz> <20190327193918.GP11927@dhcp22.suse.cz> <6f8b4c51-3f3c-16f9-ca2f-dbcd08ea23e6@linux.alibaba.com> <20190328065802.GQ11927@dhcp22.suse.cz> <6487e0f5-aee4-3fea-00f5-c12602b8ad2b@linux.alibaba.com> <20190328191206.GC7155@dhcp22.suse.cz> From: Yang Shi Message-ID: <5934ed42-c512-a4c7-cbed-9062065bf276@linux.alibaba.com> Date: Thu, 28 Mar 2019 12:40:14 -0700 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.12; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.7.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <20190328191206.GC7155@dhcp22.suse.cz> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Language: en-US Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org Precedence: bulk List-ID: X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org On 3/28/19 12:12 PM, Michal Hocko wrote: > On Thu 28-03-19 11:58:57, Yang Shi wrote: >> >> On 3/27/19 11:58 PM, Michal Hocko wrote: >>> On Wed 27-03-19 19:09:10, Yang Shi wrote: >>>> One question, when doing demote and promote we need define a path, for >>>> example, DRAM <-> PMEM (assume two tier memory). When determining what nodes >>>> are "DRAM" nodes, does it make sense to assume the nodes with both cpu and >>>> memory are DRAM nodes since PMEM nodes are typically cpuless nodes? >>> Do we really have to special case this for PMEM? Why cannot we simply go >>> in the zonelist order? In other words why cannot we use the same logic >>> for a larger NUMA machine and instead of swapping simply fallback to a >>> less contended NUMA node? It can be a regular DRAM, PMEM or whatever >>> other type of memory node. >> Thanks for the suggestion. It makes sense. However, if we don't specialize a >> pmem node, its fallback node may be a DRAM node, then the memory reclaim may >> move the inactive page to the DRAM node, it sounds not make too much sense >> since memory reclaim would prefer to move downwards (DRAM -> PMEM -> Disk). > There are certainly many details to sort out. One thing is how to handle > cpuless nodes (e.g. PMEM). Those shouldn't get any direct allocations > without an explicit binding, right? My first naive idea would be to only Wait a minute. I thought we were arguing about the default allocation node mask yesterday. And, the conclusion is PMEM node should not be excluded from the node mask. PMEM nodes are cpuless nodes. I think I should replace all "PMEM node" to "cpuless node" in the cover letter and commit logs to make it explicitly. Quoted from Dan "For ACPI platforms the HMAT is effectively going to enforce "cpu-less" nodes for any memory range that has differentiated performance from the conventional memory pool, or differentiated performance for a specific initiator." I apologize I didn't elaborate PMEM nodes are cpuless nodes at the first place. Of course, cpuless node may be not PMEM node. To your question, yes, I do agree. Actually, this is what I mean about "DRAM only by default", or I should rephrase it to "exclude cpuless node", I thought they mean the same thing. > migrate-on-reclaim only from the preferred node. We might need If we exclude cpuless nodes, yes. The preferred node would be DRAM node only. Actually, the patchset does follow "migrate-on-reclaim only from the preferred node". Thanks, Yang > additional heuristics but I wouldn't special case PMEM from other > cpuless NUMA nodes.