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From: Dan Williams <dan.j.williams@intel.com>
To: Dave Chinner <david@fromorbit.com>
Cc: Jan Kara <jack@suse.cz>,
	"linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org" <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>,
	"jmoyer@redhat.com" <jmoyer@redhat.com>,
	"hch@lst.de" <hch@lst.de>, "axboe@fb.com" <axboe@fb.com>,
	"akpm@linux-foundation.org" <akpm@linux-foundation.org>,
	"linux-nvdimm@lists.01.org" <linux-nvdimm@ml01.01.org>,
	"willy@linux.intel.com" <willy@linux.intel.com>,
	"ross.zwisler@linux.intel.com" <ross.zwisler@linux.intel.com>
Subject: Re: [PATCH 5/5] block: enable dax for raw block devices
Date: Mon, 26 Oct 2015 11:48:06 +0900	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <CAPcyv4hjGYYPRyPjZc3CymmnSObB7mULRbeMZFjnKdoCD_m7pw@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20151025212247.GI19199@dastard>

On Mon, Oct 26, 2015 at 6:22 AM, Dave Chinner <david@fromorbit.com> wrote:
> On Thu, Oct 22, 2015 at 11:08:18PM +0200, Jan Kara wrote:
>> Ugh2: Now I realized that DAX mmap isn't safe wrt fs freezing even for
>> filesystems since there's nothing which writeprotects pages that are
>> writeably mapped. In normal path, page writeback does this but that doesn't
>> happen for DAX. I remember we once talked about this but it got lost.
>> We need something like walk all filesystem inodes during fs freeze and
>> writeprotect all pages that are mapped. But that's going to be slow...
>
> fsync() has the same problem - we have no record of the pages that
> need to be committed and then write protected when fsync() is called
> after write()...

I know Ross is still working on that implementation.  However, I had a
thought on the flight to ksummit that maybe we shouldn't worry about
tracking dirty state on a per-page basis.  For small / frequent
synchronizations an application really should be using the nvml
library [1] to issue cache flushes and pcommit from userspace on a
per-cacheline basis.  That leaves unmodified apps that want to be
correct in the presence of dax mappings.  Two things we can do to
mitigate that case:

1/ Make DAX mappings opt-in with a new MMAP_DAX (page-cache bypass)
flag.  Applications shouldn't silently become incorrect simply because
the fs is mounted with -o dax.  If an app doesn't understand DAX
mappings it should get page-cache semantics.  This also protects apps
that are not expecting DAX semantics on raw block device mappings.

2/ Even if we get a new flag that lets the kernel know the app
understands DAX mappings, we shouldn't leave fsync broken.  Can we
instead get by with a simple / big hammer solution?  I.e.

    on_each_cpu(sync_cache, ...);

...where sync_cache is something like:

    cache_disable();
    wbinvd();
    pcommit();
    cache_enable();

Disruptive, yes, but if an app cares about efficient persistent memory
synchronization fsync is already the wrong api.

  reply	other threads:[~2015-10-26  2:48 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 23+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2015-10-22  6:41 [PATCH 0/5] block, dax: updates for 4.4 Dan Williams
2015-10-22  6:41 ` [PATCH 1/5] pmem, dax: clean up clear_pmem() Dan Williams
2015-10-22  6:41 ` [PATCH 2/5] dax: increase granularity of dax_clear_blocks() operations Dan Williams
2015-10-22  9:26   ` Jan Kara
2015-10-22  6:41 ` [PATCH 3/5] block, dax: fix lifetime of in-kernel dax mappings with dax_map_atomic() Dan Williams
2015-10-22  6:42 ` [PATCH 4/5] block: introduce file_bd_inode() Dan Williams
2015-10-22  9:45   ` Jan Kara
2015-10-22 15:41     ` Dan Williams
2015-10-22  6:42 ` [PATCH 5/5] block: enable dax for raw block devices Dan Williams
2015-10-22  9:35   ` Jan Kara
2015-10-22 16:05     ` Williams, Dan J
2015-10-22 21:08       ` Jan Kara
2015-10-22 23:41         ` Williams, Dan J
2015-10-24 12:21           ` Jan Kara
2015-10-23 23:32         ` Dan Williams
2015-10-24 14:49           ` Jan Kara
2015-10-25 21:22         ` Dave Chinner
2015-10-26  2:48           ` Dan Williams [this message]
2015-10-26  6:23             ` Dave Chinner
2015-10-26  7:20               ` Jan Kara
2015-10-26  8:56               ` Dan Williams
2015-10-26 22:19                 ` Dave Chinner
2015-10-27 22:55                   ` Ross Zwisler

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