From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S1754423AbXD1Xkx (ORCPT ); Sat, 28 Apr 2007 19:40:53 -0400 Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org id S1754425AbXD1Xkx (ORCPT ); Sat, 28 Apr 2007 19:40:53 -0400 Received: from smtp1.linux-foundation.org ([65.172.181.25]:53847 "EHLO smtp1.linux-foundation.org" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-OK) by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S1754419AbXD1Xkv (ORCPT ); Sat, 28 Apr 2007 19:40:51 -0400 Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2007 16:40:31 -0700 (PDT) From: Linus Torvalds To: Markus Rechberger cc: Adrian Bunk , Diego Calleja , Chuck Ebbert , Linux Kernel Mailing List Subject: Re: Linux 2.6.21 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: <20070426125802.GL3468@stusta.de> <4630DB24.4030005@redhat.com> <20070426201325.8a1ebda3.diegocg@gmail.com> <20070426224148.69b91b2e.diegocg@gmail.com> <20070428195320.GZ3468@stusta.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=us-ascii Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org On Sun, 29 Apr 2007, Markus Rechberger wrote: > > I totally disagree here, bugzilla is a very good tool. If someone is > too lazy to look at it it's his problem. You must be doing things very differently from a lot of other people if you think that's the case. > Kernel Janitors can pick out some bugs which aren't addressed by > anyone or got left behind. IF that happened, it would actually be great. That's what I'm arguing for. And it was basically what Adrian was doing! > How else should bugs get handled, sending them to the lkml? Actually, looking at Adrian's regression lists, yes. lkml worked better than bugzilla did. By at _least_ a factor of two. > I'm 100% sure some bugreports will also get lost then, but on the lkml > they'll very likely remain lost whereas in the bugzilla they'll remain > as open. What's the difference between bugzilla and lkml.org? Both have search buttons. Both archive the old stuff. Both can be pointed to. > what are your suggestions to improve a bugreporting tool, I'm very > sure that many people, especially people who want to get into existing > projects here, would love to contribute. I don't know what the perfect setup is, but I do know that bugzilla is very close to be totally useless for the top-level maintainers. Try to think like a person who doesn't maintain *one* specific file in the kernel, but who can actually make a good judgement about a lot of things, or at least funnel a problem report to the right person? And now, imagine that that person is also fairly busy (exactly *because* he's not looking at a single file, he may be maintaining a huge subsystem that has multiple submaintainers etc). And ask yourself whether bugzilla really helps. > I'd say this is a personal opinion, some people will get along with it > and some of them will not... I think bugzilla really only works for very "directed" issues. If you already know exactly which driver is affected (which is often wrong anyway: some of the bugs that were due timer breakage got blamed as disk hangs!) it's almost totally useless. And yes, maybe that's why you have a much higher opinion of bugzilla than I do. To _me_ bugzilla is a total mess. There's absolutely _zero_ useful information there. And I'm pretty certain that is true of a *lot* of other people too. But if you have a small project, or you maintain a very specific (and clearly delineated) part of a big project, bugzilla probably looks a lot more palatable. Linus