From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S1763913AbZANQSk (ORCPT ); Wed, 14 Jan 2009 11:18:40 -0500 Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org id S1761246AbZANQSb (ORCPT ); Wed, 14 Jan 2009 11:18:31 -0500 Received: from yw-out-2324.google.com ([74.125.46.29]:40702 "EHLO yw-out-2324.google.com" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-OK) by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S1761367AbZANQSa (ORCPT ); Wed, 14 Jan 2009 11:18:30 -0500 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=nPDKaGARDmpqVpjDj/q+1QzrnAJEGLkOfpBxi0GSS+NsC8kEUiq2ASBkqx2PiDE7H2 gBDzcKJJIa0u9sQ89+IpqAeqh0aLxU8Q2EKqexG4IfW97SpwkkNXtFgEm9T36fRHwuaq ndKbPN/M+oQPgOom8igzwA4xwetGZw/neMp1A= MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <496DB067.6060402@linux.intel.com> References: <20081227155019.GA15493@elte.hu> <20081227225102.GA17822@elte.hu> <49594411.60000@linux.intel.com> <20090113174522.GA26965@elte.hu> <496DB067.6060402@linux.intel.com> Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 08:18:29 -0800 Message-ID: Subject: Re: x86/mce merge, integration hickup + crash, design thoughts From: Tim Hockin To: Andi Kleen Cc: Ingo Molnar , Thomas Gleixner , linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, "H. Peter Anvin" , ying.huang@intel.com, Aaron Durbin , priyankag@google.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org List-ID: X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org On Wed, Jan 14, 2009 at 1:29 AM, Andi Kleen wrote: > >> >> I'm 100% on board with that and will even help staff the effort. > > Well if you want to change anything the code would be a good idea first to > establish clearly what is actually broken. I know various areas that need > improvement (and I have patches fixes most of them), but to my knowledge > none of them would be fixed by ASCII logging. > > Perhaps a good start would be if Ingo could expand what exactly > he believes is broken currently. At least his earlier "high level" argument > seems to be large based on clear misunderstandings of what kind > of MCE events are common and what not. I don't really blame > him for that since MCEs are obscure and difficult and badly > documented (I had a hard time getting up to speed on them myself > and it took me quite some time). But I hope he doesn't > dismiss the advice from people who have more experience with > them than him though. > > I wrote a long email earlier in the thread with all the reasons why > ASCII logging is difficult (like the various atomicity issues and also > others) > I haven't heard anyone refuting any of the arguments in there, so I assume > they > are agreed one by everyone. > > I would appreciate if the people who continue to propose ASCII > logging would explain how they plan to solve these problems. > >> This >> is something that is VERY HIGHLY desired here. > > What is exactly desired? >>From my point of view: a single, consistent, easy logging interface for the kernel to send *structured data* about hardware/system events and errors up to userspace. I don't care if it is ASCII, but it probably can be done in ASCII. That's the cart before the horse, IMHO. I just want something more structured and better suited than printk(). >> I already have a >> couple peopel looking at this and other HW-error reporting issues. > > I have lots of patches pending for over half a year (including > tons of bug fixes) and they get all delayed again and again with > very little justification why. So before writing any new code > it would be good to just get the already pending improvements in. We'd LOVE your improvements, if they work. MCE is always a sore point for us, in that we take too many of them. Anything to reduce their impact is a win. Tim