From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 06:26:42 -0400 Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 06:26:32 -0400 Received: from lanm-pc.com ([64.81.97.118]:48629 "EHLO golux.thyrsus.com") by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 06:26:17 -0400 Date: Sat, 11 Aug 2001 06:23:49 -0400 From: "Eric S. Raymond" To: Linux Kernel List Subject: Kernel lockups on dual-Athlon board -- help wanted Message-ID: <20010811062349.A1769@thyrsus.com> Reply-To: esr@thyrsus.com Mail-Followup-To: "Eric S. Raymond" , Linux Kernel List Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i Organization: Eric Conspiracy Secret Labs X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org Gary Sandine of Los Alamos Computers and I are attempting to qualify Linux on a Tyan 2462 K7 Thunder motherboard -- dual Athlon 1200 MP chips supported by an AMD 760 chipset. We have been seeing mysterious lockups during commands to build things from source, like kernels and X. We've been trying to track down the problem for about sixteen hours and have gathered quite a bit of data, but don't have a theory to explain it. First, we have established that this is a real kernel hang, not just a bad device state: A. Lockups can be induced in either console or X mode. A reliable way to induce them is to run `make clean' on an X tree (any sufficiently long-running command seems to do it). B. We logged in over the network, started a top(1) in the network session, induced the hang on the console, and watch top(1) freeze. So C. The magic AltSysRq command is ineffective when the lockups happen. Here's what we know about it: 1. Lockups never occur under a uniprocessor kernel. 2. Configuring APM and ACPI out of the kernel does not prevent the lockups. Disabling ACPI and power management doesn't stop them either. 3. Changing kernels from 2.4.3 to 2.4.7 doesn't prevent the lockups. 4. The SMP kernel built for either PII or AMD (no APM, no ACPI) locks up. 5. There is an undocumented BIOS setting "Use PCI Interrupt Entries in MP table." By default it is on. Turning it off doesn't prevent the lockups. 6. Here's a weird one. When the kernel is running, the power switch has to be pressed down for 4 seconds to power down the machine. But during a lockup it powers down the machine instantly. What we're seeing suggests some bad interaction between the SMP support and the hardware. But item 7 hints that power management could be involved, even though we have it configured out. Anybody have a brilliant insight? Suggestions for further tests? -- Eric S. Raymond Government should be weak, amateurish and ridiculous. At present, it fulfills only a third of the role. -- Edward Abbey From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 06:46:48 -0400 Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 06:46:38 -0400 Received: from tahallah.demon.co.uk ([158.152.175.193]:47628 "EHLO tahallah.demon.co.uk") by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 06:46:30 -0400 Date: Sat, 11 Aug 2001 11:46:14 +0100 (BST) From: Alex Buell X-X-Sender: Reply-To: To: "Eric S. Raymond" cc: Linux Kernel List Subject: Re: Kernel lockups on dual-Athlon board -- help wanted In-Reply-To: <20010811062349.A1769@thyrsus.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org On Sat, 11 Aug 2001, Eric S. Raymond wrote: > 6. Here's a weird one. When the kernel is running, the power switch > has to be pressed down for 4 seconds to power down the machine. But > during a lockup it powers down the machine instantly. > > What we're seeing suggests some bad interaction between the SMP > support and the hardware. But item 7 hints that power management > could be involved, even though we have it configured out. You appear to be missing item 7. -- Sigfault: Witty message dumped. http://www.tahallah.demon.co.uk From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 09:17:29 -0400 Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 09:17:17 -0400 Received: from router-100M.swansea.linux.org.uk ([194.168.151.17]:20999 "EHLO the-village.bc.nu") by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 09:17:14 -0400 Subject: Re: Kernel lockups on dual-Athlon board -- help wanted To: esr@thyrsus.com Date: Sat, 11 Aug 2001 14:19:36 +0100 (BST) Cc: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org (Linux Kernel List) In-Reply-To: <20010811062349.A1769@thyrsus.com> from "Eric S. Raymond" at Aug 11, 2001 06:23:49 AM X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL5] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: From: Alan Cox Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org > 6. Here's a weird one. When the kernel is running, the power switch > has to be pressed down for 4 seconds to power down the machine. But > during a lockup it powers down the machine instantly. > > What we're seeing suggests some bad interaction between the SMP > support and the hardware. But item 7 hints that power management > could be involved, even though we have it configured out. Try a completely different board and components. There are folks running rock solid 2.4 on dual Athlons. I speculate yours is perhaps marginal somewhere. Alan From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 12:09:06 -0400 Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 12:08:56 -0400 Received: from sal.qcc.sk.ca ([198.169.27.3]:44306 "HELO sal.qcc.sk.ca") by vger.kernel.org with SMTP id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 12:08:47 -0400 Date: Sat, 11 Aug 2001 10:08:58 -0600 From: Charles Cazabon To: Linux Kernel List Subject: Re: Kernel lockups on dual-Athlon board -- help wanted Message-ID: <20010811100858.A11219@qcc.sk.ca> Mail-Followup-To: Linux Kernel List In-Reply-To: <20010811062349.A1769@thyrsus.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2i In-Reply-To: <20010811062349.A1769@thyrsus.com>; from esr@thyrsus.com on Sat, Aug 11, 2001 at 06:23:49AM -0400 Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org Eric S. Raymond wrote: > > A. Lockups can be induced in either console or X mode. A reliable way to > induce them is to run `make clean' on an X tree (any sufficiently > long-running command seems to do it). This sounds like bad hardware. > 6. Here's a weird one. When the kernel is running, the power switch > has to be pressed down for 4 seconds to power down the machine. But > during a lockup it powers down the machine instantly. This is normal for ATX machines. There's usually a BIOS setting controlling whether the power switch is instant or delayed, but once the software isn't running any more, it's always instant. I really do think it's bad hardware -- CPU, mainboard, power supply, or some combination of the above. Charles -- ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Charles Cazabon GPL'ed software available at: http://www.qcc.sk.ca/~charlesc/software/ ----------------------------------------------------------------------- From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 12:25:19 -0400 Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 12:25:00 -0400 Received: from lanm-pc.com ([64.81.97.118]:15350 "EHLO golux.thyrsus.com") by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 12:24:51 -0400 Date: Sat, 11 Aug 2001 12:22:18 -0400 From: "Eric S. Raymond" To: Alex Buell Cc: Linux Kernel List Subject: Re: Kernel lockups on dual-Athlon board -- help wanted Message-ID: <20010811122218.E6024@thyrsus.com> Reply-To: esr@thyrsus.com Mail-Followup-To: "Eric S. Raymond" , Alex Buell , Linux Kernel List In-Reply-To: <20010811062349.A1769@thyrsus.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: ; from alex.buell@tahallah.demon.co.uk on Sat, Aug 11, 2001 at 11:46:14AM +0100 Organization: Eric Conspiracy Secret Labs X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org Alex Buell : > On Sat, 11 Aug 2001, Eric S. Raymond wrote: > > > 6. Here's a weird one. When the kernel is running, the power switch > > has to be pressed down for 4 seconds to power down the machine. But > > during a lockup it powers down the machine instantly. > > > > What we're seeing suggests some bad interaction between the SMP > > support and the hardware. But item 7 hints that power management > > could be involved, even though we have it configured out. > > You appear to be missing item 7. It was 0400 and I was fried. I was referring to the item 6 you quoted. -- Eric S. Raymond Militias, when properly formed, are in fact the people themselves and include all men capable of bearing arms. [...] To preserve liberty it is essential that the whole body of the people always possess arms and be taught alike, especially when young, how to use them. -- Senator Richard Henry Lee, 1788, on "militia" in the 2nd Amendment From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 12:24:39 -0400 Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 12:24:29 -0400 Received: from ebiederm.dsl.xmission.com ([166.70.28.69]:57707 "EHLO flinx.biederman.org") by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 12:24:19 -0400 To: esr@thyrsus.com Cc: Linux Kernel List Subject: Re: Kernel lockups on dual-Athlon board -- help wanted In-Reply-To: <20010811062349.A1769@thyrsus.com> From: ebiederm@xmission.com (Eric W. Biederman) Date: 11 Aug 2001 10:17:38 -0600 In-Reply-To: <20010811062349.A1769@thyrsus.com> Message-ID: User-Agent: Gnus/5.0808 (Gnus v5.8.8) Emacs/20.5 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org "Eric S. Raymond" writes: > Gary Sandine of Los Alamos Computers and I are attempting to qualify > Linux on a Tyan 2462 K7 Thunder motherboard -- dual Athlon 1200 MP > chips supported by an AMD 760 chipset. We have been seeing mysterious > lockups during commands to build things from source, like kernels and X. > > We've been trying to track down the problem for about sixteen hours > and have gathered quite a bit of data, but don't have a theory to explain > it. What kind of case are you running in? I have heard of one other case that sounds similiar and in that case the system was in a 1U. > First, we have established that this is a real kernel hang, not just a > bad device state: > > A. Lockups can be induced in either console or X mode. A reliable way to > induce them is to run `make clean' on an X tree (any sufficiently > long-running command seems to do it). > > B. We logged in over the network, started a top(1) in the network > session, induced the hang on the console, and watch top(1) freeze. > So > > C. The magic AltSysRq command is ineffective when the lockups happen. > > Here's what we know about it: > > 1. Lockups never occur under a uniprocessor kernel. > > 2. Configuring APM and ACPI out of the kernel does not prevent the lockups. > Disabling ACPI and power management doesn't stop them either. > > 3. Changing kernels from 2.4.3 to 2.4.7 doesn't prevent the lockups. > > 4. The SMP kernel built for either PII or AMD (no APM, no ACPI) locks up. > > 5. There is an undocumented BIOS setting "Use PCI Interrupt Entries in > MP table." By default it is on. Turning it off doesn't prevent the > lockups. This switches between listing the 4 interrupts that the board uses for pci between either in the ISA range if interrupts or routing them to the IOAPIC above the normal 16 ISA interrupts. > 6. Here's a weird one. When the kernel is running, the power switch > has to be pressed down for 4 seconds to power down the machine. But > during a lockup it powers down the machine instantly. > > What we're seeing suggests some bad interaction between the SMP > support and the hardware. But item 7 hints that power management > could be involved, even though we have it configured out. The board only uses ACPI so power management isn't a large canidate. I think I have to go with Alan that the most likely case is that the board is marginal in respect. Eric From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 12:35:01 -0400 Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 12:34:50 -0400 Received: from lanm-pc.com ([64.81.97.118]:16118 "EHLO golux.thyrsus.com") by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 12:34:36 -0400 Date: Sat, 11 Aug 2001 12:32:00 -0400 From: "Eric S. Raymond" To: Alan Cox Cc: Linux Kernel List Subject: Re: Kernel lockups on dual-Athlon board -- help wanted Message-ID: <20010811123200.F6024@thyrsus.com> Reply-To: esr@thyrsus.com Mail-Followup-To: "Eric S. Raymond" , Alan Cox , Linux Kernel List In-Reply-To: <20010811062349.A1769@thyrsus.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: ; from alan@lxorguk.ukuu.org.uk on Sat, Aug 11, 2001 at 02:19:36PM +0100 Organization: Eric Conspiracy Secret Labs X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org Alan Cox : > Try a completely different board and components. There are folks > running rock solid 2.4 on dual Athlons. I speculate yours is perhaps > marginal somewhere. OK... 1. By "different board" do you mean different instance of the same design, or different design? Because the K7 Thunder is, AFAIK, the only dual-Athlon 1200 board that exists right now. 2. Do you know of anyone else successfully running 2.4 over an AMD 760 support chipset? 3. Which components do you think are likely to be implicated? Bad memory is an obvious guess, I suppose. -- Eric S. Raymond "Both oligarch and tyrant mistrust the people, and therefore deprive them of arms." --Aristotle From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 12:44:21 -0400 Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 12:44:12 -0400 Received: from quattro.sventech.com ([205.252.248.110]:18954 "HELO quattro.sventech.com") by vger.kernel.org with SMTP id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 12:43:58 -0400 Date: Sat, 11 Aug 2001 12:44:09 -0400 From: Johannes Erdfelt To: "Eric S. Raymond" , Alan Cox , Linux Kernel List Subject: Re: Kernel lockups on dual-Athlon board -- help wanted Message-ID: <20010811124409.Y3126@sventech.com> In-Reply-To: <20010811062349.A1769@thyrsus.com> <20010811123200.F6024@thyrsus.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.12i In-Reply-To: <20010811123200.F6024@thyrsus.com>; from esr@thyrsus.com on Sat, Aug 11, 2001 at 12:32:00PM -0400 Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org On Sat, Aug 11, 2001, Eric S. Raymond wrote: > Alan Cox : > > Try a completely different board and components. There are folks > > running rock solid 2.4 on dual Athlons. I speculate yours is perhaps > > marginal somewhere. > > OK... > > 1. By "different board" do you mean different instance of the same design, or > different design? Because the K7 Thunder is, AFAIK, the only dual-Athlon > 1200 board that exists right now. I suspect he means same design, different physical hardware. > 2. Do you know of anyone else successfully running 2.4 over an AMD 760 > support chipset? I am. I have had some cooling problems with some of the hardware in the past. > 3. Which components do you think are likely to be implicated? Bad memory > is an obvious guess, I suppose. Cooling most likely. What kind of system is this? Rackmount? Desktop case? JE From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 12:53:31 -0400 Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 12:53:21 -0400 Received: from lanm-pc.com ([64.81.97.118]:21494 "EHLO golux.thyrsus.com") by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 12:53:13 -0400 Date: Sat, 11 Aug 2001 12:50:35 -0400 From: "Eric S. Raymond" To: Johannes Erdfelt Cc: Alan Cox , Linux Kernel List Subject: Re: Kernel lockups on dual-Athlon board -- help wanted Message-ID: <20010811125035.A6428@thyrsus.com> Reply-To: esr@thyrsus.com Mail-Followup-To: "Eric S. Raymond" , Johannes Erdfelt , Alan Cox , Linux Kernel List In-Reply-To: <20010811062349.A1769@thyrsus.com> <20010811123200.F6024@thyrsus.com> <20010811124409.Y3126@sventech.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <20010811124409.Y3126@sventech.com>; from johannes@erdfelt.com on Sat, Aug 11, 2001 at 12:44:09PM -0400 Organization: Eric Conspiracy Secret Labs X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org Johannes Erdfelt : > > different design? Because the K7 Thunder is, AFAIK, the only dual-Athlon > > 1200 board that exists right now. > > I suspect he means same design, different physical hardware. Yes, he said so in a reply. > > 2. Do you know of anyone else successfully running 2.4 over an AMD 760 > > support chipset? > > I am. > > I have had some cooling problems with some of the hardware in the past. > > > 3. Which components do you think are likely to be implicated? Bad memory > > is an obvious guess, I suppose. > > Cooling most likely. What kind of system is this? Rackmount? Desktop > case? Server case. Seems to be running pretty cool -- the processor heatsinks are warm to the touch but not hot. We've got a power-supply fan, two coolers, and two case fans. Did you find you needed more than that? -- Eric S. Raymond There's a truism that the road to Hell is often paved with good intentions. The corollary is that evil is best known not by its motives but by its *methods*. From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 13:11:55 -0400 Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 13:11:45 -0400 Received: from [206.40.202.198] ([206.40.202.198]:57716 "EHLO scsoftware.sc-software.com") by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 13:11:29 -0400 Date: Sat, 11 Aug 2001 10:09:07 +0000 ( ) From: John Heil To: "Eric S. Raymond" cc: Johannes Erdfelt , Alan Cox , Linux Kernel List Subject: Re: Kernel lockups on dual-Athlon board -- help wanted In-Reply-To: <20010811125035.A6428@thyrsus.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org On Sat, 11 Aug 2001, Eric S. Raymond wrote: > Date: Sat, 11 Aug 2001 12:50:35 -0400 > From: "Eric S. Raymond" > To: Johannes Erdfelt > Cc: Alan Cox , > Linux Kernel List > Subject: Re: Kernel lockups on dual-Athlon board -- help wanted > > Johannes Erdfelt : > > > different design? Because the K7 Thunder is, AFAIK, the only dual-Athlon > > > 1200 board that exists right now. > > > > I suspect he means same design, different physical hardware. > > Yes, he said so in a reply. > > > > 2. Do you know of anyone else successfully running 2.4 over an AMD 760 > > > support chipset? > > > > I am. > > > > I have had some cooling problems with some of the hardware in the past. > > > > > 3. Which components do you think are likely to be implicated? Bad memory > > > is an obvious guess, I suppose. > > > > Cooling most likely. What kind of system is this? Rackmount? Desktop > > case? > > Server case. Seems to be running pretty cool -- the processor heatsinks > are warm to the touch but not hot. We've got a power-supply fan, two coolers, > and two case fans. Did you find you needed more than that? You might try a heat sink & fan on the north bridge chip. Also your cpu fans ought to be of the 7+K RPM variety. > -- > Eric S. Raymond > > There's a truism that the road to Hell is often paved with good intentions. > The corollary is that evil is best known not by its motives but by its > *methods*. > - > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in > the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org > More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html > Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/ > - ----------------------------------------------------------------- John Heil South Coast Software Custom systems software for UNIX and IBM MVS mainframes 1-714-774-6952 johnhscs@sc-software.com http://www.sc-software.com ----------------------------------------------------------------- From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 13:25:17 -0400 Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 13:25:07 -0400 Received: from lanm-pc.com ([64.81.97.118]:1271 "EHLO golux.thyrsus.com") by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 13:24:55 -0400 Date: Sat, 11 Aug 2001 13:22:09 -0400 From: "Eric S. Raymond" To: John Heil Cc: Johannes Erdfelt , Alan Cox , Linux Kernel List Subject: Re: Kernel lockups on dual-Athlon board -- help wanted Message-ID: <20010811132209.A11076@thyrsus.com> Reply-To: esr@thyrsus.com Mail-Followup-To: "Eric S. Raymond" , John Heil , Johannes Erdfelt , Alan Cox , Linux Kernel List In-Reply-To: <20010811125035.A6428@thyrsus.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: ; from kerndev@sc-software.com on Sat, Aug 11, 2001 at 10:09:07AM +0000 Organization: Eric Conspiracy Secret Labs X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org John Heil : > You might try a heat sink & fan on the north bridge chip. > Also your cpu fans ought to be of the 7+K RPM variety. Interesting. We're going to put Silverados on the CPUs as soon as we can get them -- if you don't know what those are, they're a super-well- designed cooler that can chill a chip by 24 degrees centigrade. Low-noise, too, they only emit 37dBA. Where is the north bridge chip on the board? I have the mobo diagram from the Tyan site but it doesn't show that. -- Eric S. Raymond Americans have the will to resist because you have weapons. If you don't have a gun, freedom of speech has no power. -- Yoshimi Ishikawa, Japanese author, in the LA Times 15 Oct 1992 From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 13:33:19 -0400 Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 13:33:09 -0400 Received: from [206.40.202.198] ([206.40.202.198]:60276 "EHLO scsoftware.sc-software.com") by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 13:33:05 -0400 Date: Sat, 11 Aug 2001 10:30:46 +0000 ( ) From: John Heil To: "Eric S. Raymond" cc: Johannes Erdfelt , Alan Cox , Linux Kernel List Subject: Re: Kernel lockups on dual-Athlon board -- help wanted In-Reply-To: <20010811132209.A11076@thyrsus.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org On Sat, 11 Aug 2001, Eric S. Raymond wrote: > Date: Sat, 11 Aug 2001 13:22:09 -0400 > From: "Eric S. Raymond" > To: John Heil > Cc: Johannes Erdfelt , > Alan Cox , > Linux Kernel List > Subject: Re: Kernel lockups on dual-Athlon board -- help wanted > > John Heil : > > You might try a heat sink & fan on the north bridge chip. > > Also your cpu fans ought to be of the 7+K RPM variety. > > Interesting. We're going to put Silverados on the CPUs as soon as we > can get them -- if you don't know what those are, they're a super-well- > designed cooler that can chill a chip by 24 degrees centigrade. Low-noise, > too, they only emit 37dBA. > > Where is the north bridge chip on the board? I have the mobo diagram from the > Tyan site but it doesn't show that. It's the AMD-762 system controller, the one with the metallic cap on top. > -- > Eric S. Raymond > > Americans have the will to resist because you have weapons. > If you don't have a gun, freedom of speech has no power. > -- Yoshimi Ishikawa, Japanese author, in the LA Times 15 Oct 1992 > - ----------------------------------------------------------------- John Heil South Coast Software Custom systems software for UNIX and IBM MVS mainframes 1-714-774-6952 johnhscs@sc-software.com http://www.sc-software.com ----------------------------------------------------------------- From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 13:58:06 -0400 Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 13:57:56 -0400 Received: from sal.qcc.sk.ca ([198.169.27.3]:45586 "HELO sal.qcc.sk.ca") by vger.kernel.org with SMTP id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 13:57:48 -0400 Date: Sat, 11 Aug 2001 11:57:59 -0600 From: Charles Cazabon To: Linux Kernel List Subject: Re: Kernel lockups on dual-Athlon board -- help wanted Message-ID: <20010811115759.B19840@qcc.sk.ca> Mail-Followup-To: Linux Kernel List In-Reply-To: <20010811125035.A6428@thyrsus.com> <20010811132209.A11076@thyrsus.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2i In-Reply-To: <20010811132209.A11076@thyrsus.com>; from esr@thyrsus.com on Sat, Aug 11, 2001 at 01:22:09PM -0400 Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org Eric S. Raymond wrote: > John Heil : > > You might try a heat sink & fan on the north bridge chip. > > Also your cpu fans ought to be of the 7+K RPM variety. > > Interesting. We're going to put Silverados on the CPUs as soon as we > can get them -- if you don't know what those are, they're a super-well- > designed cooler that can chill a chip by 24 degrees centigrade. Are you sure of that spec? 24 degrees isn't a whole lot for a CPU cooler. An Athlon without a fan can reach 70 centigrade before it fries a few seconds later, and many of the coolers in use with them can bring them down to high-20s. 24 degrees isn't enough. ALso, I doubt it's memory -- you'd see segfaults or oopses. Bad or overheated CPU, unstable or underpowered power supply, or faulty mainboard is more likely for your symptoms. Charles -- ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Charles Cazabon GPL'ed software available at: http://www.qcc.sk.ca/~charlesc/software/ ----------------------------------------------------------------------- From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 15:32:04 -0400 Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 15:31:55 -0400 Received: from host154.207-175-42.redhat.com ([207.175.42.154]:59024 "EHLO lacrosse.corp.redhat.com") by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id ; Sat, 11 Aug 2001 15:31:43 -0400 Date: Sat, 11 Aug 2001 15:31:40 -0400 (EDT) From: Ben LaHaise X-X-Sender: To: "Eric S. Raymond" cc: Johannes Erdfelt , Alan Cox , Linux Kernel List Subject: Re: Kernel lockups on dual-Athlon board -- help wanted In-Reply-To: <20010811125035.A6428@thyrsus.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org On Sat, 11 Aug 2001, Eric S. Raymond wrote: > Server case. Seems to be running pretty cool -- the processor heatsinks > are warm to the touch but not hot. We've got a power-supply fan, two coolers, > and two case fans. Did you find you needed more than that? Depends on how many drives you've got in the case. The dual Athlon I'm using has three case fans: two pulling air out from just below the power supply and one drawing air into the case at the front. The only crashes I've experienced on the machine were caused by kernel bugs. =) -ben -- "The world would be a better place if Larry Wall had been born in Iceland, or any other country where the native language actually has syntax" -- Peter da Silva