From: Mimi Zohar <zohar@linux.ibm.com>
To: Dionna Glaze <drdeeglaze@gmail.com>, Jiri Pirko <jiri@resnulli.us>
Cc: Jason Gunthorpe <jgg@nvidia.com>,
Jarkko Sakkinen <jarkko@kernel.org>,
linux-coco@lists.linux.dev, linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org,
linux-api@vger.kernel.org, x86@kernel.org, kvm@vger.kernel.org,
linux-doc@vger.kernel.org, david.quigley@intel.com,
lukas@wunner.de, ksinyuk@kernel.org, rodrigo.vivi@intel.com,
cedric.xing@intel.com, sameo@meta.com,
James.Bottomley@hansenpartnership.com, aik@amd.com,
jpiotrowski@nvidia.com, qinkun@google.com, pgonda@google.com,
jic23@kernel.org, alistair.francis@wdc.com, ankita@nvidia.com,
suzuki.poulose@arm.com, kas@kernel.org,
rick.p.edgecombe@intel.com, elena.reshetova@intel.com,
dave.hansen@linux.intel.com,
sathyanarayanan.kuppuswamy@linux.intel.com, peter.fang@intel.com,
roberto.sassu@huawei.com
Subject: Re: [PATCH RFC 00/20] attestation: Add a common subsystem and TDX support
Date: Tue, 20 Oct 2026 09:45:13 -0400 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <a69c7e7ac4fd07a9c375faadc599e96bb8c8534e.camel@linux.ibm.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <CANwfdvUhuQ6L+w+91iDZD=diMmaJ6_2ZsFKkcoiKWOmPMC1oKg@mail.gmail.com>
On Mon, 2026-10-19 at 09:10 -0700, Dionna Glaze wrote:
> On Mon, Oct 19, 2026 at 5:08 AM Jiri Pirko <jiri@resnulli.us> wrote:
> >
> > Yeah, I was thinking about this and went back and forth. In the end, the
> > only reason for leaving it unbounded is to allow multiple independent
> > users of the same register. For example, IMA and systemd could share a
> > TDX RTMR. The systemd side would read the journal through the
> > attestation device and the IMA side through securityfs, but both are
> > views of the same journal. If one side truncated it, the other could no
> > longer replay the RTMR. Isn't this the valid usecase? Do you see how to
> > resolve this?
> >
>
> Bright minds have spent a significant amount of time working on this.
>
> +Roberto Sassu, +Mimi Zohar
Dionna, thank you for including us in this discussion.
Based on my questioning AI, it sounds like the purpose of this patch set is to
introduce a vendor-agnostic common attestation subsystem framework that can act
as an internal kernel multiplexor for any measurement consumer, like IMA or
DRTM. By providing a direct kernel-to-kernel call path, it allows measurements
to be routed to different Roots of Trust (ROT)—such as physical motherboard
TPMs, Intel TDX RTMRs, AMD SEV-SNP registers, and PCIe SPDM devices—without
hardcoding IMA to specific device drivers.
To support this framework, IMA requires a strict, atomic execution sequence to
maintain the Measure → Extend → Execute (Measure Before Use) guarantee. This
initializes early during the late_initcall phase within the initramfs (via
dracut).
If the new subsystem introduces a direct kernel-to-kernel multiplexing call
path, how will it ensure the mandatory synchronous wait behavior when extending
multiple hardware backends?
I strongly agree with Jason’s point that we should table any discussions
regarding a new dynamic log or uAPI additions at this stage, and focus strictly
on exposing the static firmware-level TDX log. I also echo Jiri’s concern that
replacing the securityfs template log with a placeholder string would break
backwards compatibility for the existing IMA ecosystem.
Thanks,
Mimi
> IMA logs and systemd logs are both system level concerns that are
> relevant to the OS construction, not individual users,
> so I would just say to reroute IMA to use ctlv using a kernel config
> setting, then make systemd the new system manager of the holistic log.
> The securityfs log contents can simply say, "log managed by ctlv" in
> this setting, in the form of the template identifier.
> For policy violations, only the 0... extend needs to go to ctlv.
> IMA can still keep its violation log as a ring buffer when it's not a
> 1-to-1 violation to extension
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2026-10-20 13:45 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 52+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2026-10-15 14:50 Jiri Pirko
2026-10-15 14:50 ` [PATCH RFC 01/20] ctlv: Add the schema language and generator Jiri Pirko
2026-10-15 14:50 ` [PATCH RFC 02/20] ctlv: Add the UAPI wire format and family API Jiri Pirko
2026-10-19 23:29 ` Jason Gunthorpe
2026-10-20 12:26 ` Jiri Pirko
2026-10-15 14:50 ` [PATCH RFC 03/20] ctlv: Add the root family specification and generated files Jiri Pirko
2026-10-19 23:29 ` Jason Gunthorpe
2026-10-20 12:28 ` Jiri Pirko
2026-10-20 12:55 ` Jason Gunthorpe
2026-10-20 14:07 ` Jiri Pirko
2026-10-15 14:50 ` [PATCH RFC 04/20] Documentation: ctlv: Add userspace ABI Jiri Pirko
2026-10-19 23:29 ` Jason Gunthorpe
2026-10-20 14:06 ` Jiri Pirko
2026-10-15 14:50 ` [PATCH RFC 05/20] ctlv: Prepare message input handling Jiri Pirko
2026-10-15 14:50 ` [PATCH RFC 06/20] ctlv: Prepare blob descriptor validation Jiri Pirko
2026-10-15 14:50 ` [PATCH RFC 07/20] ctlv: Prepare schema validation Jiri Pirko
2026-10-15 14:50 ` [PATCH RFC 08/20] ctlv: Prepare message output handling Jiri Pirko
2026-10-15 14:50 ` [PATCH RFC 09/20] ctlv: Prepare VA blob handling Jiri Pirko
2026-10-15 14:50 ` [PATCH RFC 10/20] ctlv: Prepare event queue support Jiri Pirko
2026-10-15 14:50 ` [PATCH RFC 11/20] ctlv: Prepare runtime introspection Jiri Pirko
2026-10-15 14:50 ` [PATCH RFC 12/20] ctlv: Add device and operation dispatch Jiri Pirko
2026-10-15 14:50 ` [PATCH RFC 13/20] Documentation: ctlv: Describe how to write a family Jiri Pirko
2026-10-19 23:29 ` Jason Gunthorpe
2026-10-15 14:50 ` [PATCH RFC 14/20] attestation: Add the base family specification and generated files Jiri Pirko
2026-10-15 14:50 ` [PATCH RFC 15/20] attestation: Prepare provider and instance core Jiri Pirko
2026-10-19 23:29 ` Jason Gunthorpe
2026-10-15 14:50 ` [PATCH RFC 16/20] attestation: Prepare measurement register journal Jiri Pirko
2026-10-15 14:50 ` [PATCH RFC 17/20] attestation: Add CTLV operation handling Jiri Pirko
2026-10-15 14:50 ` [PATCH RFC 18/20] tdx-guest: Expose the native attestation service API Jiri Pirko
2026-10-15 14:50 ` [PATCH RFC 19/20] attestation: Add the TDX family specification and generated files Jiri Pirko
2026-10-15 14:50 ` [PATCH RFC 20/20] attestation: Add the TDX family implementation Jiri Pirko
2026-10-16 23:43 ` [PATCH RFC 00/20] attestation: Add a common subsystem and TDX support Jason Gunthorpe
2026-10-17 18:16 ` Dionna Glaze
2026-10-17 19:06 ` Jarkko Sakkinen
2026-10-17 19:08 ` Jarkko Sakkinen
2026-10-17 19:22 ` Jarkko Sakkinen
2026-10-17 20:55 ` Jason Gunthorpe
2026-10-17 21:14 ` Jarkko Sakkinen
2026-10-17 20:34 ` Jason Gunthorpe
2026-10-17 20:55 ` Jarkko Sakkinen
2026-10-17 23:10 ` Jason Gunthorpe
2026-10-18 23:53 ` Dionna Glaze
2026-10-19 12:08 ` Jiri Pirko
2026-10-19 16:10 ` Dionna Glaze
2026-10-19 22:56 ` Jason Gunthorpe
2026-10-20 9:26 ` Jiri Pirko
2026-10-20 13:45 ` Mimi Zohar [this message]
2026-10-20 14:06 ` Jason Gunthorpe
2026-10-19 12:40 ` Jarkko Sakkinen
2026-10-19 23:11 ` Jason Gunthorpe
2026-10-20 12:49 ` James Bottomley
2026-10-20 13:13 ` Jason Gunthorpe
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