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From: David Matlack <dmatlack@google.com>
To: tarunsahu@google.com
Cc: Andrew Morton <akpm@linux-foundation.org>,
	joro@8bytes.org, Mike Rapoport <rppt@kernel.org>,
	Pratyush Yadav <pratyush@kernel.org>,
	maz@kernel.org, arnd@arndb.de, jgg@nvidia.com,
	robin.murphy@arm.com, loganodell@google.com, oupton@kernel.org,
	kevin.tian@intel.com, alex@shazbot.org, dwmw2@infradead.org,
	pbonzini@redhat.com, seanjc@google.com, will@kernel.org,
	Pasha Tatashin <pasha.tatashin@soleen.com>,
	Alexander Graf <graf@amazon.com>,
	Bjorn Helgaas <bhelgaas@google.com>,
	baolu.lu@linux.intel.com, linux-arm-kernel@lists.infradead.org,
	linux-arch@vger.kernel.org, sagis@google.com, linux-mm@kvack.org,
	kvmarm@lists.linux.dev, iommu@lists.linux.dev,
	linux-pci@vger.kernel.org, kexec@lists.infradead.org,
	skhawaja@google.com, kvm@vger.kernel.org,
	linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org
Subject: Re: [RFC PATCH v2 3/4] liveupdate: Replace compatibility string with a 2-bit pair feature header
Date: Mon, 26 Oct 2026 21:14:05 +0000	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <at_CncIPYCxOVkLo@google.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <9huzzew0el59.fsf@tarunix.c.googlers.com>

On 2026-10-26 11:50 AM, tarunsahu@google.com wrote:
> Right, Required bit should be source kernel payload property to tell
> target kernel that the payload must be handled to correctly deserialize
> the data. It should be source kernel (userspace) responsiblity to make
> sure it understand the target kernel before doing liveupdate.
> 
> Saying this, During deserialization, target kernel's required bit is not
> necessary. So I propose the following truth table.
> 
> Source hdr  Target supported[i]  Action
> ----------  -------------------  ----------------------------------
> 00          0 or 1               Accept: feature absent in payload
> 01          0                    Accept: ignore the feature data
> 01          1                    Accept: use the feature data
> 11          0                    Reject: -EOPNOTSUPP
> 11          1                    Accept: use the feature data
> 10          0 or 1               Reject: -EINVAL (invalid encoding)

Yes, this matches what I had in mind for the semantics.

To be explicit: the source kernel should set the bits for each Live
Update based on what is actually preserved, rather than generating the
header from a static per-kernel array. E.g. memfd would only mark a
feature present for memfds that actually use it. That's what allows
rollback to an older kernel as long as nothing being preserved depends
on the new feature.

But looking at this again, I think the required bit is redundant. Whether
a feature can be safely ignored is a property of the feature itself, not
of any particular file. Every file that has a feature present will have
the same required bit for it. The only thing that actually varies per
file is whether the feature is present.

The required bit still has to be conveyed to the target somehow, since
the kernel that needs it is the one that doesn't know about the feature.
But it can be conveyed by the feature's number rather than an extra bit:
split the flag space into required features and optional features, and
assign each feature to one of them when it is defined. This is similar
to the required_flags and optional_flags approach in struct pci_ser [1].

Keeping the same header shape as discussed with Pasha:

struct kho_ser_hdr {
    __u32 size;           /* Size of header + payload in bytes */
    __u16 nr_required;    /* Number of required feature bits */
    __u16 nr_optional;    /* Number of optional feature bits */
    __u64 flags[];        /* Required bits, followed by optional bits */
};

Required feature N is bit N of flags[], and optional feature N is bit
nr_required + N (using nr_required from the incoming header). The length
of flags[] is DIV_ROUND_UP(nr_required + nr_optional, 64). Both spaces
are numbered contiguously, so there are no gaps, and up to 64 features
still fit in a 16-byte header.

Each bit just means the feature is present, so the truth table becomes:

Source bit       Target supports  Action
---------------  ---------------  ------------------------------
Not set          -                Accept: feature absent
Optional set     No               Accept: ignore the feature data
Optional set     Yes              Accept: use the feature data
Required set     No               Reject: -EOPNOTSUPP
Required set     Yes              Accept: use the feature data

There is no invalid encoding left to check.

[1] https://lore.kernel.org/linux-pci/20261013162529.1928093-1-dmatlack@google.com/

  reply	other threads:[~2026-10-26 21:14 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 51+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2026-10-21 15:25 [RFC PATCH v2 0/4] liveupdate: Feature header ABI and named handler Tarun Sahu
2026-10-21 15:25 ` [RFC PATCH v2 1/4] liveupdate: Rename handler compatible to name Tarun Sahu
2026-10-21 17:11   ` Pasha Tatashin
2026-10-21 18:16     ` tarunsahu
2026-10-21 19:11       ` Pasha Tatashin
2026-10-21 19:35         ` tarunsahu
2026-10-23  7:44           ` Mike Rapoport
2026-10-23 21:51             ` tarunsahu
2026-10-21 15:25 ` [RFC PATCH v2 2/4] liveupdate: Select file handler by name in the preserve ioctl Tarun Sahu
2026-10-21 17:17   ` Pasha Tatashin
2026-10-21 23:02     ` David Matlack
2026-10-22  1:14       ` Pasha Tatashin
2026-10-22 17:57         ` David Matlack
2026-10-22 12:50     ` tarunsahu
2026-10-22 13:42       ` Pasha Tatashin
2026-10-21 15:25 ` [RFC PATCH v2 3/4] liveupdate: Replace compatibility string with a 2-bit pair feature header Tarun Sahu
2026-10-21 17:27   ` Pasha Tatashin
2026-10-21 17:40     ` Jason Gunthorpe
2026-10-21 17:55       ` Pasha Tatashin
2026-10-21 18:40     ` tarunsahu
2026-10-21 18:46       ` David Matlack
2026-10-21 18:50         ` Pasha Tatashin
2026-10-21 23:28           ` David Matlack
2026-10-22  1:26             ` Pasha Tatashin
2026-10-22  2:57               ` David Matlack
2026-10-22  3:32                 ` Pasha Tatashin
2026-10-22  3:52                   ` David Matlack
2026-10-22  4:11                     ` Pasha Tatashin
2026-10-22 17:51                       ` David Matlack
2026-10-22 20:53                         ` Pasha Tatashin
2026-10-23 13:50                           ` David Matlack
2026-10-25 20:38                             ` Pasha Tatashin
2026-10-26 20:49                               ` David Matlack
2026-10-27 16:21                                 ` Pasha Tatashin
2026-10-27 17:33                                   ` David Matlack
2026-10-21 23:55   ` David Matlack
2026-10-22  0:04     ` David Matlack
2026-10-26 11:50       ` tarunsahu
2026-10-26 21:14         ` David Matlack [this message]
2026-10-26 23:28           ` tarunsahu
2026-10-27  0:01             ` David Matlack
2026-10-27  0:55               ` Tarun Sahu
2026-10-27  3:26                 ` David Matlack
2026-10-27 16:40           ` Pasha Tatashin
2026-10-27 17:37             ` David Matlack
2026-10-21 15:25 ` [RFC PATCH v2 4/4] mm: memfd_luo: Add the " Tarun Sahu
2026-10-21 17:38   ` Pasha Tatashin
2026-10-21 23:18     ` David Matlack
2026-10-22  0:41       ` Pasha Tatashin
2026-10-22  2:51         ` David Matlack
2026-10-22  3:50           ` Pasha Tatashin

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