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From: Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org>
To: david@lang.hm
Cc: Frans Pop <elendil@planet.nl>,
	jeff@garzik.org, arjan@infradead.org, akpm@linux-foundation.org,
	dwmw2@infradead.org, alan@lxorguk.ukuu.org.uk,
	linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org
Subject: Re: [GIT *] Allow request_firmware() to be satisfied from in-kernel, use it in more drivers.
Date: Tue, 15 Jul 2008 09:41:10 -0700 (PDT)	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <alpine.LFD.1.10.0807150936070.3017@woody.linux-foundation.org> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.1.10.0807150931290.16109@asgard.lang.hm>



On Tue, 15 Jul 2008, david@lang.hm wrote:
>
> David W has made it very clear that the eventual intent of this patch series
> is to remove all firmware from the kernel tree and have it shipped as a
> seperate package.

I don't think that kind of black-and-white model is necessarily 
attainable. Nor do I think it's even _good_.

It's probably the right thign for _some_ firmware, assuming we have models 
that just make it easy enough - for drivers where it's generally better 
for distros to get the firmware from vendors rather than the kernel.

But there is certainly nothing inherently good in forcing a split.

I think both sides here need to calm down and stop being so extreme.

I do want request_firmware() to be the way to load firmware (and possibly 
other configuration data too, for that matter - I don't think it's 
necessarily wrong for people to "misuse" it for other long-term data 
despite the name), and I do want people to be able to update firmware 
easily without having to force a kernel bump, but I also don't think it 
means that firmware has to go away from the kernel sources.

So I think the _infrastructure_ is important. But the extreme "you have to 
split it off entirely" mindset is equally as stupid as the "you must 
compile it into the module" mindset.

			Linus

  reply	other threads:[~2008-07-15 16:42 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 227+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2008-07-14 23:23 David Woodhouse
2008-07-14 23:41 ` Andrew Morton
2008-07-14 23:47   ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-14 23:53     ` Yinghai Lu
2008-07-15  0:23       ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15  0:31         ` Yinghai Lu
2008-07-15  0:50           ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15  1:08             ` Yinghai Lu
2008-07-15  7:50             ` Ingo Molnar
2008-07-15  0:50         ` Yinghai Lu
2008-07-15  0:52           ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15  0:53             ` Yinghai Lu
2008-07-15  1:13           ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15 20:45     ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-07-15 20:49       ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15 20:57         ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15 23:45           ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-07-16  7:01         ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-16 21:28           ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-07-16 22:42             ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-17 20:42               ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-07-17 21:25                 ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-17 22:25                   ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-07-18  4:15                 ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-14 23:59   ` Arjan van de Ven
2008-07-15  0:06     ` david
2008-07-15  0:33       ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15  0:51         ` david
2008-07-15  1:02           ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15  1:18             ` david
2008-07-15  2:08               ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15  2:47                 ` david
2008-07-15  7:57                 ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 15:04                   ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 17:01                     ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 17:09                       ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 17:30                         ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 17:41                           ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 17:45                             ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 18:11                               ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 18:21                                 ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 18:33                                   ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 18:20                             ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 18:25                               ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 18:30                                 ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15 20:00                                   ` Marcel Holtmann
2008-07-15 20:06                                     ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15 20:30                                       ` Marcel Holtmann
2008-07-15 21:24                                       ` david
2008-07-15 18:44                                 ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 18:53                                   ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 19:09                                     ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 19:18                                       ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 18:58                                   ` Theodore Tso
2008-07-15 19:14                                     ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 19:19                                       ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 19:23                                         ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 21:14                                         ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 21:24                                           ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15 21:47                                             ` David Miller
2008-07-15 22:42                                               ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15 22:45                                                 ` David Miller
2008-07-15 23:05                                                 ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 21:24                                           ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 21:39                                             ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 22:12                                               ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15 22:46                                                 ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-16  0:55                                                 ` Sven-Haegar Koch
2008-07-16  8:02                                                   ` Gabor Gombas
2008-07-16  4:55                                       ` Rene Herman
2008-07-15 19:27                                     ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15  1:52           ` David Miller
2008-07-15  2:23             ` Rene Herman
2008-07-15  2:24               ` David Miller
2008-07-15  2:32                 ` Rene Herman
2008-07-15  2:39                 ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15  2:45                   ` David Miller
2008-07-15  4:56                     ` Arjan van de Ven
2008-07-15  5:09                       ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15  5:45                         ` david
2008-07-15  6:03                           ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15  6:23                             ` Oliver Neukum
2008-07-15 14:40                               ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15 16:52                                 ` Oliver Neukum
2008-07-15 18:09                                   ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15  5:32                       ` Rene Herman
2008-07-15  3:06                   ` Rene Herman
2008-07-15 23:33                   ` Alexandre Oliva
2008-07-15  5:15                 ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2008-07-15  5:30                   ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15  1:50         ` David Miller
2008-07-15  2:54           ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15  5:34             ` david
2008-07-15  0:36       ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15  0:40         ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15  0:44           ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15  5:05             ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2008-07-15  2:12         ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15  2:17           ` David Miller
2008-07-15  2:23             ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15  2:52               ` david
2008-07-15  4:45               ` Willy Tarreau
2008-07-15  1:54     ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15  2:13       ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15  2:19         ` David Miller
2008-07-15  2:22         ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15  2:33           ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15  2:40             ` David Miller
2008-07-15  2:51               ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15  3:05                 ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15  4:58                 ` Willy Tarreau
2008-07-15 14:55                   ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 15:09                     ` david
2008-07-15 16:01                       ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 16:21                         ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15 17:56                         ` david
2008-07-15 17:35                     ` Willy Tarreau
2008-07-15 17:44                       ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15  3:15             ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15  3:29               ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15  5:06                 ` Willy Tarreau
2008-07-15  5:32                   ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15  5:36                     ` Willy Tarreau
2008-07-15  5:37                     ` david
2008-07-16  0:10                     ` Alexandre Oliva
2008-07-16  0:26                       ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15  7:21                 ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15  7:36                   ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15  8:07                     ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 15:10                       ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 16:53                         ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 17:16                         ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 17:25                           ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 17:54                             ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15  8:14                     ` Ingo Molnar
2008-07-15  8:24                       ` Ingo Molnar
2008-07-15 12:42                   ` Alan Cox
2008-07-17 21:31                     ` David Miller
2008-07-15  2:48           ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15  5:12             ` Willy Tarreau
2008-07-15 15:57         ` Frans Pop
2008-07-15 16:04           ` Arjan van de Ven
2008-07-15 16:24             ` Frans Pop
2008-07-15 16:36             ` Frans Pop
2008-07-15 17:33               ` Arjan van de Ven
2008-07-15 17:57                 ` Frans Pop
2008-07-15 16:15           ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 16:33             ` david
2008-07-15 16:41               ` Linus Torvalds [this message]
2008-07-15 17:25                 ` Frans Pop
2008-07-15 17:36                 ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15 19:22                 ` Marcel Holtmann
2008-07-15 16:35             ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 16:48               ` Frans Pop
2008-07-15 17:07                 ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 19:26               ` Marcel Holtmann
2008-07-15 16:37             ` Frans Pop
2008-07-15 18:05           ` Henrique de Moraes Holschuh
2008-07-15 18:14             ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 18:24               ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 18:37                 ` Chris Friesen
2008-07-15 18:55                 ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 19:02                   ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 19:41                     ` david
2008-07-15 19:59                     ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 20:15                       ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 20:55                         ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 23:02                           ` Dave Jones
2008-07-15 23:46                             ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-16  0:00                               ` Dave Jones
2008-07-16  0:10                           ` Chris Adams
2008-07-16  6:04                             ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 19:07                   ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15 19:29                 ` Peter T. Breuer
2008-07-15 18:20             ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15 19:13               ` Frans Pop
2008-07-15 19:39             ` Marcel Holtmann
2008-07-15 19:20           ` Marcel Holtmann
2008-07-15 19:27             ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 19:31               ` Marcel Holtmann
2008-07-15 19:38                 ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 19:44                   ` Marcel Holtmann
2008-07-15 22:19                     ` Adrian Bunk
2008-07-15 19:32               ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 19:36               ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15 19:49                 ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 19:54                   ` Marcel Holtmann
2008-07-15 20:07                     ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 20:21                       ` Marcel Holtmann
2008-07-15 20:30                         ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 20:33                         ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 21:17                         ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 20:26                       ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 20:47                         ` Willy Tarreau
2008-07-15 21:24                           ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-16 22:05                         ` Diego Calleja
2008-07-15 21:27                       ` david
2008-07-15 21:40                         ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-15 21:43                         ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 22:20                           ` Frans Pop
2008-07-15 22:24                           ` david
2008-07-15 22:26                             ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15 22:50                               ` david
2008-07-15 23:42                             ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-16  0:22                               ` Frans Pop
2008-07-16  0:28                                 ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-16  0:43                                   ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-16  1:11                                     ` Prosaic firmware issues Alexey Dobriyan
2008-07-16  1:45                                       ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-16  5:54                                         ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-16 14:19                                           ` Alexey Dobriyan
2008-07-16  4:42                                     ` [GIT *] Allow request_firmware() to be satisfied from in-kernel, use it in more drivers Willy Tarreau
2008-09-12 20:59                                       ` Jeff Garzik
2008-09-12 21:43                                         ` Willy Tarreau
2008-07-16  0:51                               ` Theodore Tso
2008-07-16  1:36                                 ` Dave Jones
2008-07-16  2:39                                   ` Theodore Tso
2008-07-16  3:07                                   ` Jeff Garzik
2008-07-16  9:09                                     ` Peter Zijlstra
2008-07-15 19:57                   ` David Woodhouse
2008-07-15 20:10                     ` Marcel Holtmann
2008-07-15 20:17                       ` Linus Torvalds
2008-07-15 20:25                         ` Marcel Holtmann
2008-07-15 23:04                     ` Dave Jones
2008-07-15  1:44   ` David Miller
2008-07-15  9:57     ` Marcel Holtmann
2008-07-15  1:45 ` Jeff Garzik
     [not found] <aPHZW-47Y-17@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found] ` <aPIje-4ST-15@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]   ` <aPV6W-3jN-41@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]     ` <aPX8A-7qb-21@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]       ` <aPXii-7G3-25@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]         ` <aPXs2-7Vn-25@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]           ` <aPXUQ-aU-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]             ` <aPY4D-G7-23@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]               ` <aPZ0H-2ls-21@gated-at.bofh.it>

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