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From: Peter Samuelson <peter@cadcamlab.org>
To: Russell King <rmk@arm.linux.org.uk>
Cc: Linus Torvalds <torvalds@transmeta.com>,
	Keith Owens <kaos@ocs.com.au>,
	Jeff Garzik <jgarzik@mandrakesoft.com>,
	Kernel Mailing List <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>
Subject: Re: test10-pre7
Date: Tue, 31 Oct 2000 21:06:33 -0600	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <20001031210633.D1041@wire.cadcamlab.org> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <Pine.LNX.4.10.10010310930110.6866-100000@penguin.transmeta.com> <200010311928.e9VJS2d08641@flint.arm.linux.org.uk>
In-Reply-To: <200010311928.e9VJS2d08641@flint.arm.linux.org.uk>; from rmk@arm.linux.org.uk on Tue, Oct 31, 2000 at 07:28:01PM +0000


[Russell King]
> Since someone kindly enlightened me that LINK_FIRST was unsorted, I'm
> finding it very hard to grasp what the difference is between an
> unsorted LINK_FIRST and unsorted LINK_LAST list, and an unsorted
> obj-y list.  From what I understand, obj-y = $(LINK_FIRST)
> $(LINK_LAST) ?

Not quite.  If that's how you understand it, I see why you think it's a
bad idea.  Here's what is *really* happening:

  obj-y = {subset of LINK_FIRST that is in obj-y} \
          {subset of obj-y that is not in LINK_FIRST or LINK_LAST} \
          {subset of LINK_LAST that is in obj-y}

GNU make has extensions that make this easy to implement -- no more
verbose than the pseudocode, in fact.

The biggest difference between LINK_FIRST and obj-y is that LINK_FIRST
is meant to be a static list, not dependent on CONFIG_*, and specifies
*only* those objects which must be linked before (or after, for
LINK_LAST) other objects.  In the common case, most object files do
*not* appear in LINK_FIRST or LINK_LAST, but just in O_OBJS.

In the pathological case of strict requirements for the whole
directory, LINK_FIRST would contain all of obj-y.  Keith and I think
this is a rare case -- a more common case is the opposite:
LINK_FIRST/LAST are empty because there are *no* ordering requirements.


Again, anything that appears in O_OBJS but not in LINK_FIRST is linked
in arbitrary order.  Anything that appears in LINK_FIRST but not in
O_OBJS is ignored.  That is why it can be a static list.

Since LINK_FIRST is a (usually short) static list, it is easy for the
author to guarantee that it has no duplicate files in it.  By contrast,
O_OBJS (or obj-y) frequently has duplicates, because of things like

  obj-$(CONFIG_FOO) := foo.o xxx.o
  obj-$(CONFIG_BAR) := bar.o xxx.o

where xxx.o is something like 8390 support for network cards.

Removing duplicates is a side effect of the GNU make 'sort' function,
which is THE ONLY REASON we want to sort $(O_OBJS).  The reordering is
the "other" side effect, the less desirable one.  GNU make does not
provide a 'uniq-without-sort' function, and while one is trivial to
write in e.g. shell, some of us consider a shell hack to be, well, more
hackish than LINK_FIRST.

** BTW, the only reason I'm still posting to this thread, which seems
   pretty moot because "Linus Has Spoken", is that I believe there is
   still a lot of misunderstanding about what LINK_FIRST actually does.
   When I'm satisfied that the opponents truly *understand* LINK_FIRST
   and still oppose it, I'll shut up.

Peter
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  parent reply	other threads:[~2000-11-01  3:07 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 71+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2000-10-30 19:32 test10-pre7 Linus Torvalds
2000-10-30 20:34 ` [PATCH] test10-pre7 Alexander Viro
2000-10-30 21:02   ` Linus Torvalds
2000-10-30 21:23     ` Alexander Viro
2000-10-30 22:01       ` Alexander Viro
2000-10-30 23:05         ` Linus Torvalds
2000-10-30 23:14           ` Alexander Viro
2000-10-30 23:17             ` Linus Torvalds
2000-10-30 22:21       ` Linus Torvalds
2000-10-30 22:06   ` Rik van Riel
2000-10-31 10:05   ` John Kennedy
2000-10-30 21:37 ` test10-pre7 Keith Owens
2000-10-30 22:01   ` test10-pre7 Jeff Garzik
2000-10-30 22:06     ` test10-pre7 Keith Owens
2000-10-30 22:13       ` test10-pre7 Jeff Garzik
2000-10-30 22:24     ` test10-pre7 Linus Torvalds
2000-10-30 22:41       ` test10-pre7 Keith Owens
2000-10-30 22:51         ` test10-pre7 Linus Torvalds
2000-10-30 23:02           ` test10-pre7 Jeff Garzik
2000-10-30 23:04             ` test10-pre7 Keith Owens
2000-10-30 23:08             ` test10-pre7 Linus Torvalds
2000-10-30 23:03           ` test10-pre7 Keith Owens
2000-10-30 23:15             ` test10-pre7 Linus Torvalds
2000-10-30 23:32               ` test10-pre7 Christoph Hellwig
2000-10-30 23:40                 ` test10-pre7 Linus Torvalds
2000-10-30 23:45                   ` test10-pre7 Christoph Hellwig
2000-10-30 23:51                     ` test10-pre7 Linus Torvalds
2000-10-30 23:57                       ` test10-pre7 Christoph Hellwig
2000-10-31  0:47                         ` test10-pre7 Linus Torvalds
2000-10-31  1:01                           ` test10-pre7 Christoph Hellwig
2000-10-31  2:54                             ` test10-pre7 Linus Torvalds
2000-10-31  1:49                           ` test10-pre7 Keith Owens
2000-10-31  2:07                             ` test10-pre7 Keith Owens
2000-10-31  2:58                             ` test10-pre7 Linus Torvalds
2000-10-31 13:55                               ` test10-pre7 Peter Samuelson
2000-10-31 17:29                                 ` test10-pre7 Linus Torvalds
2000-10-31 17:38                                   ` test10-pre7 H. Peter Anvin
2000-10-31 19:51                                     ` test10-pre7 Horst von Brand
2000-11-01  2:32                                   ` test10-pre7 Peter Samuelson
2000-10-31  4:57                             ` test10-pre7 Rusty Russell
2000-10-31  6:10                               ` test10-pre7 Linus Torvalds
2000-10-30 23:38               ` test10-pre7 Keith Owens
2000-10-30 23:47                 ` test10-pre7 Linus Torvalds
2000-10-31  0:03                   ` test10-pre7 Keith Owens
2000-10-31  9:37                 ` test10-pre7 Russell King
2000-10-31 14:02                   ` test10-pre7 Keith Owens
2000-10-31 14:16                     ` test10-pre7 Peter Samuelson
2000-10-31 17:31                     ` test10-pre7 Linus Torvalds
2000-10-31 19:28                       ` test10-pre7 Russell King
2000-10-31 20:59                         ` test10-pre7 Linus Torvalds
2000-11-01  0:16                           ` test10-pre7 (LINK ordering) Randy Dunlap
2000-11-01  0:52                             ` Jeff Garzik
2000-11-01  3:06                         ` Peter Samuelson [this message]
2000-11-01  2:35                       ` test10-pre7 Keith Owens
2000-11-01 12:46                         ` test10-pre7 Alan Cox
2000-10-31 11:59               ` test10-pre7 Peter Samuelson
2000-10-31 21:01                 ` test10-pre7 John Alvord
2000-11-01  3:30                   ` test10-pre7 Peter Samuelson
2000-10-31  8:18       ` test10-pre7 Rogier Wolff
2000-10-31  0:52 test10-pre7 Michael Elizabeth Chastain
2000-10-31  1:05 ` test10-pre7 Christoph Hellwig
2000-10-31 16:15 test10-pre7 Vladislav Malyshkin
2000-10-31 16:45 ` test10-pre7 Peter Samuelson
2000-10-31 18:07   ` test10-pre7 Vladislav Malyshkin
2000-10-31 18:38     ` test10-pre7 Linus Torvalds
2000-10-31 19:16       ` test10-pre7 H. Peter Anvin
2000-11-01  3:15         ` test10-pre7 Peter Samuelson
2000-11-01  6:11           ` test10-pre7 H. Peter Anvin
2000-11-01  6:31             ` test10-pre7 Peter Samuelson
2000-11-01  7:42     ` test10-pre7 Peter Samuelson
2000-11-03 16:26       ` test10-pre7 Vladislav Malyshkin

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