From: Kayra Cizmeci <kayracizmeci@gmail.com>
To: christian.loehle@arm.com
Cc: beata.michalska@arm.com, cl@gentwo.org,
daniel.lezcano@kernel.org, dietmar.eggemann@arm.com,
elif.topuz@arm.com, juri.lelli@redhat.com,
kprateek.nayak@amd.com, linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org,
linux-pm@vger.kernel.org, mingo@redhat.com, peterz@infradead.org,
rafael@kernel.org, rostedt@goodmis.org, sh@gentwo.org,
vincent.guittot@linaro.org, vschneid@redhat.com
Subject: Re: [PATCH 2/2] sched/fair: Randomize equally shallow slow-path candidates
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2026 14:46:49 +0300 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <20260916114650.2627-1-kayracizmeci@gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <ea2c4680-ccee-4ad5-978c-95dade454091@arm.com>
> > Hello Christian :>
> >
> >> Picking the first eligible idle CPU leaves a scan-order bias. Concurrent
> >> slow-path selectors can choose the same CPU before either task is enqueued.
> >
> >> Use reservoir sampling in the tie branch, resetting the candidate count
> >> when a lower advertised exit latency is found. Use the per-CPU scheduler
> >> PRNG and reciprocal_scale() to avoid variable division or a second scan.
> >
> >> This reduces deterministic convergence without reserving the chosen CPU.
> >
> > OK.
> >
> > But, your test platform was 160 Cores too. I don't think randomization has the same effect on lower
> > CPU systems.
> >
> > Let's create a scenario:
> >
> > On a 80 Core System, that %50 of it's CPU's are idle the randomization's chance of choosing the same CPU
> > is low. Since there are 40 CPU's to choose from.
> >
> > But on a 8 Core System in the same idle conditions, randomization's chance of choosing the same CPU
> > is really higher. Since there are only 4 CPU's to choose from.
> >
> > I think this solution works better on higher CPU counted systems.
> Yes, this mostly works for higher CPU count domains, but the
> issue I'm trying to fix basically doesn't exist in the 8 CPU domain
> in the first place (first of all fewer chances of having simultaneous
> slow paths running that can race and also the slow path is much faster,
> i.e. the race window much smaller).
> >
> > And I don't think it fully removes the issue. Just better than the original tho.
> > Thinks can still go bad on this one too, just harder.
> Fully removing the issue would require some synchronisation which the
> numbers (which admittedly are pretty modest already) just don't justify.
> >
> > Maybe we could add a fallback. Because the real concern is the selected CPU's state
> > changes when we come to enqueue. If possible tho, I did not really test anything.
> And then do what? rescan?
> I don't think increasing the slow path is justified at all, when this relatively
> straightforward randomization already significantly reduces the chance
> for the 'pathological' test platform.
Fair.
My real concern is that randomization is not predictable while the other solutions are.
I don't really care about their speed when it comes to that.
That's just a concern tho. I think this version is better than just placing the task
to the CPU anyways. (in terms of approach)
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2026-09-16 11:46 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 17+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2026-09-16 10:01 [PATCH 0/2] sched/fair: Randomize equally shallow idle CPU picks Christian Loehle
2026-09-16 10:01 ` [PATCH 1/2] sched/fair: Drop idle recency from slow-path CPU selection Christian Loehle
2026-09-17 13:28 ` Vincent Guittot
2026-09-16 10:01 ` [PATCH 2/2] sched/fair: Randomize equally shallow slow-path candidates Christian Loehle
2026-09-16 11:06 ` Kayra Cizmeci
2026-09-16 11:10 ` Christian Loehle
2026-09-16 11:12 ` Christian Loehle
2026-09-16 11:46 ` Kayra Cizmeci [this message]
2026-09-16 19:43 ` Shubhang
2026-09-17 7:47 ` Christian Loehle
2026-09-17 9:58 ` Christian Loehle
2026-09-17 14:02 ` Vincent Guittot
2026-09-17 14:16 ` Kayra Cizmeci
2026-09-17 14:08 ` Vincent Guittot
2026-09-17 14:22 ` Christian Loehle
2026-09-17 15:08 ` Vincent Guittot
2026-09-17 15:17 ` Christian Loehle
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