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From: Keith Owens <kaos@ocs.com.au>
To: Alan Cox <alan@lxorguk.ukuu.org.uk>
Cc: torvalds@transmeta.com (Linus Torvalds),
	garzik@havoc.gtf.org (Legacy Fishtank),
	linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, lm@bitmover.com (Larry McVoy),
	esr@thyrsus.com (Eric S. Raymond), davej@suse.de (Dave Jones),
	marcelo@conectiva.com.br (Marcelo Tosatti),
	kbuild-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
Subject: Re: State of the new config & build system
Date: Sat, 29 Dec 2001 12:57:47 +1100	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <8178.1009591067@ocs3.intra.ocs.com.au> (raw)
In-Reply-To: Your message of "Sat, 29 Dec 2001 01:53:17 -0000." <E16K8gY-0002fQ-00@the-village.bc.nu>

On Sat, 29 Dec 2001 01:53:17 +0000 (GMT), 
Alan Cox <alan@lxorguk.ukuu.org.uk> wrote:
>> dependency problem, any solution that does not fix _all_ 9 problems in
>> http://prdownloads.sourceforge.net/kbuild/kbuild-2.5-history.tar.bz2,
>> makefile-2.5_make_dep.html is not a complete fix.
>
>All well and good but "takes 100% longer" is number 10 on that list which
>you missed off, and the same argument holds for that.

You are missing the point Alan.

* The makefile rules are correct now.
* The build is correct now.
* kbuild 2.5 is faster on small compiles and much faster on recompiles
  after small changes.
* kbuild 2.5 is slower on large compiles.
* The speed problem is fixable, given time.  Correctness came first.
* I don't have time to keep tracking multiple kernels and architectures
  _and_ rewrite the core code.
* Once kbuild 2.5 is in the kernel I can spend far less time on
  tracking changes and can redesign the core programs for speed.
* It will get faster!

Why do you expect a change in a development kernel to be perfect first
time?  Look at all the bio changes, I just did a full 2.5.1 build and
had to disable 87 config options before the kernel would build, and
that is ignoring all the warning messages which point to out of date
function definitions.  Is anybody complaining that bio should have
worked first time?

Unlike bio, kbuild 2.5 works, it just needs to be a bit faster.  Put
kbuild 2.5 in the kernel and I will have a faster version within 2
weeks.


  reply	other threads:[~2001-12-29  1:58 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 140+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2001-12-28  0:24 Eric S. Raymond
2001-12-28  0:54 ` Dave Jones
2001-12-28  0:57   ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-12-28  1:15     ` Larry McVoy
2001-12-28  1:35       ` Keith Owens
2001-12-28  1:37         ` Larry McVoy
2001-12-28  1:41           ` Keith Owens
2001-12-28  1:47             ` Larry McVoy
2001-12-28  1:57               ` Keith Owens
2001-12-28  2:01                 ` Larry McVoy
2001-12-28 14:14                   ` Alan Cox
2001-12-28 14:16                     ` Keith Owens
2001-12-28 17:14                     ` Christer Weinigel
2001-12-28 17:39                       ` Alan Cox
2001-12-29  1:44                         ` Keith Owens
2001-12-29  4:09                           ` Legacy Fishtank
2001-12-30  3:34                             ` Viktor Rosenfeld
2001-12-30  4:24                               ` Dave Jones
2001-12-30 14:37                                 ` Viktor Rosenfeld
2001-12-29 17:11                           ` Christer Weinigel
2001-12-28 17:43                     ` Larry McVoy
2001-12-28 18:17                       ` Alan Cox
2001-12-28 20:54                       ` Larry McVoy
2001-12-29  9:24                       ` Anton Blanchard
2001-12-29 16:28                         ` Larry McVoy
2002-01-01  4:03                 ` Mike Touloumtzis
2002-01-01  8:26                   ` Keith Owens
2002-01-06  8:55                     ` [kbuild-devel] " Martin Mares
2002-01-06 22:19                       ` Keith Owens
2002-01-09 17:16                         ` Martin Mares
2002-01-01  8:55                   ` Peter Samuelson
2001-12-28 22:31               ` Martin Dalecki
2001-12-28 23:02                 ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-12-28 14:24             ` Alan Cox
2001-12-28 20:56         ` Kai Germaschewski
2001-12-28 21:16           ` Legacy Fishtank
2001-12-28 22:17             ` Linus Torvalds
2001-12-28 23:44               ` Kai Germaschewski
2001-12-30 12:05                 ` [kbuild-devel] " Christoph Hellwig
2001-12-29  1:27               ` Keith Owens
2001-12-29  1:53                 ` Alan Cox
2001-12-29  1:57                   ` Keith Owens [this message]
2001-12-29  2:10                     ` Alan Cox
2001-12-29  4:06                 ` Legacy Fishtank
2001-12-29 13:32                 ` Rik van Riel
2001-12-29 20:23                 ` Linus Torvalds
2001-12-29  1:26             ` Keith Owens
2001-12-29  3:58               ` Legacy Fishtank
2001-12-29  4:21                 ` Mike Castle
2001-12-29  4:44                   ` Keith Owens
2001-12-29  4:52                     ` Arnaldo Carvalho de Melo
2001-12-29 11:10                       ` PORTUGUês EM?? Astinus
2001-12-29  6:59                     ` State of the new config & build system Nicholas Knight
2001-12-29  7:41                     ` Legacy Fishtank
2001-12-29  8:13                       ` Andrew Morton
2001-12-29  9:40                         ` Daniel Phillips
2002-01-03 10:46                           ` Pavel Machek
2002-01-03 20:29                             ` Dave Jones
2002-01-03 20:35                               ` Alexander Viro
2002-01-03 20:46                                 ` Keith Owens
2002-01-03 21:30                                   ` Alexander Viro
2002-01-03 21:50                                     ` Keith Owens
2002-01-03 22:11                                       ` Alexander Viro
2002-01-03 22:44                                         ` Keith Owens
2002-01-04  1:49                                       ` Andreas Bombe
2002-01-04  2:31                                         ` Keith Owens
2002-01-04 21:40                                           ` Andreas Bombe
2001-12-29  7:42                     ` Miles Lane
2001-12-29  8:02                       ` Nicholas Knight
2001-12-29  8:11                         ` Mike Castle
2001-12-28 22:51           ` Larry McVoy
2001-12-29  2:54             ` Keith Owens
2001-12-29 12:43               ` Kai Germaschewski
2001-12-28  1:22     ` Dave Jones
2001-12-28  1:36       ` [kbuild-devel] " Tom Rini
2001-12-28  1:36         ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-12-28  1:38       ` Keith Owens
2001-12-28  1:30   ` [kbuild-devel] " Keith Owens
2001-12-28  9:26   ` Legacy Fishtank
2001-12-28  9:42     ` Keith Owens
2001-12-28 16:34       ` Alan Cox
2001-12-28 20:01       ` Larry McVoy
2001-12-29  0:50         ` Keith Owens
2001-12-29  0:55           ` Larry McVoy
2001-12-28 20:38       ` Richard Gooch
2001-12-28 18:02     ` Linus Torvalds
2001-12-28 18:24       ` Alan Cox
2001-12-28 22:06         ` Linus Torvalds
2001-12-28 22:08           ` [kbuild-devel] " Eric S. Raymond
2001-12-28 22:29             ` Larry McVoy
2001-12-28 22:29             ` Linus Torvalds
2001-12-28 22:58               ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-12-29  9:18                 ` Giacomo A. Catenazzi
2001-12-31 22:51         ` Horst von Brand
2001-12-31 22:55           ` Arnaldo Carvalho de Melo
2002-01-01  1:21             ` Peter Samuelson
2001-12-28 19:08       ` Riley Williams
2001-12-28 19:12       ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-12-28 20:26         ` Alexander Viro
2001-12-28 20:39           ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-12-30 13:58             ` [kbuild-devel] " Christoph Hellwig
2001-12-30 17:50               ` Jeff Garzik
2001-12-30 20:53                 ` Hartmut Holz
2001-12-30 20:15               ` Adrian Bunk
2002-01-01  4:29               ` Horst von Brand
2001-12-31 23:32             ` Horst von Brand
2001-12-28 23:20           ` Alan Cox
2001-12-30 11:42             ` [kbuild-devel] " Kai Henningsen
2001-12-31  8:24             ` GOTO Masanori
2001-12-31  6:50           ` GOTO Masanori
2001-12-28 22:11         ` Linus Torvalds
2001-12-28 22:31           ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-12-29 21:24             ` [kbuild-devel] " Tom Rini
2001-12-29 22:43               ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-12-29 23:12                 ` Tom Rini
2001-12-30  0:22                 ` Russell King
2001-12-30  0:11                   ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-12-30  5:39                 ` Rob Landley
2001-12-30 13:59                   ` Alan Cox
2001-12-30 17:14             ` David Woodhouse
2001-12-30 17:32               ` Tom Rini
2001-12-30 17:44               ` Russell King
2001-12-28 20:39       ` Legacy Fishtank
2001-12-28 20:41       ` Legacy Fishtank
2001-12-28 20:45         ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-12-28 21:19           ` Legacy Fishtank
2001-12-28 21:12             ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-12-28 22:27               ` Linus Torvalds
2001-12-28 23:05                 ` Benjamin LaHaise
2001-12-29  0:59                   ` Legacy Fishtank
2001-12-29 19:12                     ` Linus Torvalds
2001-12-29  3:21                 ` [kbuild-devel] " Keith Owens
2001-12-28 23:13           ` Alan Cox
2001-12-28 23:04             ` Eric S. Raymond
2001-12-28 23:10             ` Linus Torvalds
2001-12-28 23:12               ` Martin Dalecki
2001-12-29 13:01               ` Rik van Riel
2001-12-28 22:47       ` Martin Dalecki
2001-12-28 23:25 Stewart Smith
2001-12-29 12:01 Wayne.Brown

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