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From: Sven.Riedel@tu-clausthal.de
To: Phil Howard <phil-linux-kernel@ipal.net>
Cc: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org
Subject: Re: Journaling pointless with today's hard disks?
Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2001 02:44:31 +0100	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <20011125024431.A26191@moog.heim1.tu-clausthal.de> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20011124174134.B4372@vega.ipal.net> <200111250024.AAA10086@mauve.demon.co.uk> <20011124185321.C4372@vega.ipal.net>
In-Reply-To: <20011124185321.C4372@vega.ipal.net>

On Sat, Nov 24, 2001 at 06:53:21PM -0600, Phil Howard wrote:
> If it takes 1 second to spin down to a stop, the it probably will
> have slowed to a point where serialization writing a sector cannot
> be kept in sync within 1 to 5 milliseconds.  Once they _start_
> slowing down, time is an extremely precious resource.  That data
> pattern has to be read back at full speed.

Makes you wonder why drive manufacturers don't use some kind of NVRAM to 
simply remember the sectornumber that is being written as power fails - 
a capacitor, or even a small rechargeable battery (for the truely
paranoid), could supply the writing voltage. No (further) writing to the 
sector would be needed during spindown. And when the drive initializes 
again at boottime, it could check to see if the contents of the NVRAM is
not an "all OK" pattern, and simply rewrite the CRC of the sector in
question, unless that sector is already present in the bad-sector list
of the drive. 
Yes, this would be a bit more complex, and presents one more possible
point of failure, but the current situation seems rather abysmal...
And the data in that sector is as good as lost, anyway.

Regs,
Sven
-- 
Sven Riedel                      sr@gimp.org
Osteroeder Str. 6 / App. 13      sven.riedel@tu-clausthal.de
38678 Clausthal                  "Call me bored, but don't call me boring."
                                 - Larry Wall 

  parent reply	other threads:[~2001-11-25  1:45 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 86+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
     [not found] <mailman.1006644421.6553.linux-kernel2news@redhat.com>
2001-11-24 13:03 ` Florian Weimer
2001-11-24 13:40   ` Rik van Riel
2001-11-24 16:36     ` Phil Howard
2001-11-24 17:19       ` Charles Marslett
2001-11-24 17:31       ` Florian Weimer
2001-11-24 17:41       ` Matthias Andree
2001-11-24 19:20         ` Florian Weimer
2001-11-24 19:29           ` Rik van Riel
2001-11-24 22:51             ` John Alvord
2001-11-24 23:41               ` Phil Howard
2001-11-25  0:24                 ` Ian Stirling
2001-11-25  0:53                   ` Phil Howard
2001-11-25  1:25                     ` H. Peter Anvin
2001-11-25  1:44                     ` Sven.Riedel [this message]
2001-11-24 22:28           ` H. Peter Anvin
2001-11-25  4:49             ` Andre Hedrick
2001-11-24 23:04           ` Pedro M. Rodrigues
2001-11-24 23:23           ` Stephen Satchell
2001-11-24 23:29             ` H. Peter Anvin
2001-11-26 18:05               ` Steve Brueggeman
2001-11-26 23:49                 ` Martin Eriksson
2001-11-27  0:06                   ` Andreas Dilger
2001-11-27  0:16                     ` Andre Hedrick
2001-11-27  7:38                       ` Andreas Dilger
2001-11-27 11:48                         ` Ville Herva
2001-11-27  0:18                 ` Jonathan Lundell
2001-11-27  1:01                   ` Ian Stirling
2001-11-27  1:33                     ` H. Peter Anvin
2001-11-27  1:57                   ` Steve Underwood
2001-11-27  5:04                   ` Stephen Satchell
2001-11-25  4:20           ` Pete Zaitcev
2001-11-25 12:30           ` Matthias Andree
2001-11-25 15:04             ` Barry K. Nathan
2001-11-25 16:31               ` Matthias Andree
2001-11-27  2:39                 ` Pavel Machek
2001-12-03 10:23                   ` Matthias Andree
2001-11-25  9:14   ` Chris Wedgwood
2001-11-25 22:55     ` Daniel Phillips
2001-11-26 16:59     ` Rob Landley
2001-11-26 20:30       ` Andre Hedrick
2001-11-26 20:35         ` Rob Landley
2001-11-26 23:59           ` Andreas Dilger
2001-11-27  0:24             ` H. Peter Anvin
2001-11-27  0:52               ` H. Peter Anvin
2001-11-27  1:11                 ` Andrew Morton
2001-11-27  1:15                   ` H. Peter Anvin
2001-11-27 16:59                     ` Matthias Andree
2001-11-27 16:56                 ` Matthias Andree
2001-11-27  1:23           ` Ian Stirling
2001-11-26 23:00             ` Rob Landley
2001-11-27  2:41               ` H. Peter Anvin
2001-11-27  0:19                 ` Rob Landley
2001-11-27 23:35                   ` Andreas Bombe
2001-11-28 14:32                     ` Rob Landley
2001-11-27  3:39               ` Ian Stirling
2001-11-27  7:03           ` Ville Herva
2001-11-27 16:50           ` Matthias Andree
2001-11-27 20:31             ` Rob Landley
2001-11-28 18:43               ` Matthias Andree
2001-11-28 18:46                 ` Rob Landley
2001-11-28 22:19                   ` Matthias Andree
2001-11-29 22:21                     ` Pavel Machek
2001-12-01 10:55                       ` Jeff V. Merkey
2001-12-02  0:08                       ` Matthias Andree
2001-12-03 20:04                         ` Pavel Machek
2001-11-26 20:53       ` Richard B. Johnson
2001-11-26 21:18         ` Journaling pointless with today's hard disks? [wandering OT] Rob Landley
2001-11-27  0:32         ` Journaling pointless with today's hard disks? H. Peter Anvin
2001-11-27 16:39       ` Matthias Andree
2001-11-27 17:42         ` Martin Eriksson
2001-11-28 16:35           ` Ian Stirling
2001-11-26 17:14   ` Steve Brueggeman
2001-11-26 20:36     ` Andre Hedrick
2001-11-26 21:14       ` Steve Brueggeman
2001-11-26 21:36         ` Andre Hedrick
2001-11-27 16:36           ` Steve Brueggeman
2001-11-27 20:04             ` Bill Davidsen
2001-11-27 21:28         ` Wayne Whitney
2001-11-27 21:52           ` Andre Hedrick
2001-11-28 11:53             ` Pedro M. Rodrigues
2001-11-25 13:52 ` Pedro M. Rodrigues
2001-11-25  1:20 dnu478nt5w@mailexpire.com
2001-11-28 14:36 Galappatti, Kishantha
2001-11-28 17:22 David Balazic
2001-11-28 23:25 Frank de Lange
2001-11-29  1:52 ` Matthias Andree

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